design flaw : F20A 's air intake gets useless heat from radiator*coolant

* via thermostat is steel-piped next to & heat is transferred into

What a laugh! I just read through some as well. I love this one: "Bonnet's
rubber seals & felt, front wheels' hub caps too can be removed, to help cool
engine."

Sounds like his problem is the loose nut between the steering wheel and the
driver's seat.

Steve

 

| > Why do you own such a badly designed car?
So far all its design flaws ( 3 more & 2 inadequacies which I tell
friends & relatives ) can be corrected / mitigated. I love its 4ws (
saves time, very scarce now : no new model has 4ws ), perfect rust
proofing. No electric / hybrid / toyota's super 4ws on sale yet.

| "Bonnet's rubber seals
Removal of these let air enter & cool intake manifold & chamber
, & let out hot air produced by air con's radiator. Torque rose 3%.

| & felt
lets heat enter bonnet & escape via convection / radiation

| front wheels' hub caps too can be removed, to help cool engine.
My front wheels used to be too hot to touch, caused by this * flow
design flaw & cheapo exhaust manifold. Removal of hub cap will
let drive shaft & engine cool faster, unnecessary for well cooled
engines, but for desparate users with severe overheating, this can
help a bit, esp on original steel wheels with 15½" Ø plastic caps.

| loose nut between the steering wheel and the driver's seat.
Salesmen / dealers all deny flaws, & denigrate to deter exposers, to
protect their bread & butter, just like in 1 thread above ( 11-5-06 )
on ignition switch.

 

| > Why do you own such a badly designed car?
So far all its design flaws ( 3 more & 2 inadequacies which I tell
friends & relatives ) can be corrected / mitigated. I love its 4ws (
saves time, very scarce now : no new model has 4ws ), perfect rust
proofing. No electric / hybrid / toyota's super 4ws on sale yet.

| "Bonnet's rubber seals
Removal of these let air enter & cool intake manifold & chamber
, & let out hot air produced by air con's radiator. Torque rose 3%.

| & felt
lets heat enter bonnet & escape via convection / radiation

| front wheels' hub caps too can be removed, to help cool engine.
My front wheels used to be too hot to touch, caused by this * flow
design flaw & cheapo exhaust manifold. Removal of hub cap will
let drive shaft & engine cool faster, unnecessary for well cooled
engines, but for desparate users with severe overheating, this can
help a bit, esp on original steel wheels with 15½" Ø plastic caps.

| loose nut between the steering wheel and the driver's seat.
Salesmen / dealers all deny flaws, & denigrate to deter exposers, to
protect their bread & butter, just like in 1 thread above ( 11-5-06 )
on ignition switch.

 

i appreciate what you're saying jim, but did they drop a thermistor into
the air stream to measure the difference in air temperature between the
two? i'll be surprised if they did because i can't say i've ever seen
one of those "dyno graph" articles that ever has. without that, they're
simply measuring the dynamic air charging effect differences - what i
was talking about before. you're right, temperature /can/ make a
difference to power yield [an 80 degree difference in air temp gets you
roughly 10% difference in air density] but again, have you ever seen
temperature reading differences quoted? and what difference does it
make for a *moving vehicle* with & without cai? airflow under the hood
is, well, you get the picture... just questions to ask.

 

i appreciate what you're saying jim, but did they drop a thermistor into
the air stream to measure the difference in air temperature between the
two? i'll be surprised if they did because i can't say i've ever seen
one of those "dyno graph" articles that ever has. without that, they're
simply measuring the dynamic air charging effect differences - what i
was talking about before. you're right, temperature /can/ make a
difference to power yield [an 80 degree difference in air temp gets you
roughly 10% difference in air density] but again, have you ever seen
temperature reading differences quoted? and what difference does it
make for a *moving vehicle* with & without cai? airflow under the hood
is, well, you get the picture... just questions to ask.

 

| front wheels' hub caps too can be removed, to help cool engine.

You've got to be f***in kidding me.

Plonk.

Steve

 

| front wheels' hub caps too can be removed, to help cool engine.

You've got to be f***in kidding me.

Plonk.

Steve

 

They used the OBDII intake air temp measurements read from the ECU's own
sensors.

even with airflow under the hood,the underhood temerature is much higher
than outside.There's radiated engine heat that is retained.

You really should get a copy of the article.

 

They used the OBDII intake air temp measurements read from the ECU's own
sensors.

even with airflow under the hood,the underhood temerature is much higher
than outside.There's radiated engine heat that is retained.

You really should get a copy of the article.

 

If your wheels are too hot to touch then you probably have a brake
problem (or you are riding them/failing to downshift for long
descents). Removing the wheel covers could help with brake cooling,
but the effect on engine cooling would be negligible.

Hondas have excellent engine cooling. The only time I have ever had a
gauge go much above half was when the system had lost coolant. That
has happened two or three times in 35 vehicle years of ownership of
five Honda cars. I have run these cars in Chicago traffic in ambient
temperatures from -28F to 106F and I have never found the cooling
system to be inadequate in any way.

So I would suggest that if yours is inadequate, it may need repair or
it may be due to one or more of your modifications. If the former,
then fix the problem. If the latter, then feel free to make whatever
further modifications are necessary to correct these problems. Just
don't whine that the car is defective.

 

If your wheels are too hot to touch then you probably have a brake
problem (or you are riding them/failing to downshift for long
descents). Removing the wheel covers could help with brake cooling,
but the effect on engine cooling would be negligible.

Hondas have excellent engine cooling. The only time I have ever had a
gauge go much above half was when the system had lost coolant. That
has happened two or three times in 35 vehicle years of ownership of
five Honda cars. I have run these cars in Chicago traffic in ambient
temperatures from -28F to 106F and I have never found the cooling
system to be inadequate in any way.

So I would suggest that if yours is inadequate, it may need repair or
it may be due to one or more of your modifications. If the former,
then fix the problem. If the latter, then feel free to make whatever
further modifications are necessary to correct these problems. Just
don't whine that the car is defective.

 

his best one was about disconnecting the clock because the excessive
load on the alternator robbed power...

 

his best one was about disconnecting the clock because the excessive
load on the alternator robbed power...

 

great! what were they?

you need to re-phrase that one dude. radiated heat, by definition, is
not retained. and a sensor inside the manifold is not going to
experience much radiated heat from anything other than the manifold itself.

i think what you mean is that air drawn form under the hood i.e.
downwind of the radiator, is warmer, which is true. but in these pics

http://www.rsportscars.com/foto/03/civic-eng-broechem22000_003.jpg
http://www.rsportscars.com/foto/03/civic_si_blue_motor.jpg
http://www.clubcivic.com/gallery/files/2/3/3/4/5/DSC01335.JPG
http://www.clubcivic.com/gallery/files/2/1/3/8/2/DamdamImage384.jpg
etc.

in all these cases, the cai's are /all/ downwind of the radiator, so i
don't see what the "cold air intake" is achieving in the thermal
department, unless it's on a static vehicle with the hood open. and i'd
love to see numbers on air temp for a /moving/ vehicle, especially as
oem intakes all draw air from up front of the radiator. if all these
kiddiez were serious, they'd cut through the fender and/or hood and put
a real cold air scoop to the outside world, but i've never seen that on
a cai'd civic.

scan it and send it to tegger.

again, i see dyno differences mostly attributable to air charge
resonances, not actual air temperature.

 

great! what were they?

you need to re-phrase that one dude. radiated heat, by definition, is
not retained. and a sensor inside the manifold is not going to
experience much radiated heat from anything other than the manifold itself.

i think what you mean is that air drawn form under the hood i.e.
downwind of the radiator, is warmer, which is true. but in these pics

http://www.rsportscars.com/foto/03/civic-eng-broechem22000_003.jpg
http://www.rsportscars.com/foto/03/civic_si_blue_motor.jpg
http://www.clubcivic.com/gallery/files/2/3/3/4/5/DSC01335.JPG
http://www.clubcivic.com/gallery/files/2/1/3/8/2/DamdamImage384.jpg
etc.

in all these cases, the cai's are /all/ downwind of the radiator, so i
don't see what the "cold air intake" is achieving in the thermal
department, unless it's on a static vehicle with the hood open. and i'd
love to see numbers on air temp for a /moving/ vehicle, especially as
oem intakes all draw air from up front of the radiator. if all these
kiddiez were serious, they'd cut through the fender and/or hood and put
a real cold air scoop to the outside world, but i've never seen that on
a cai'd civic.

scan it and send it to tegger.

again, i see dyno differences mostly attributable to air charge
resonances, not actual air temperature.

 

And I'd be delighted to post such results.

And what sort of changes are we talking about here? 5 BHP? Less?

 

And I'd be delighted to post such results.

And what sort of changes are we talking about here? 5 BHP? Less?

 

they never do.

 

they never do.

 

I don't have the magazine anymore. I DO wish I'd kept it.

for CAIs(not short rams),20 HP for a RSX.
IIRC,that was measured at the wheel by Honda Tuning's dyno.