Does smaller friction area cause less friction?

Discussion in 'General Motoring' started by karl, Nov 21, 2005.

  1. karl

    karl Guest

    From:

    http://www.boltscience.com/pages/faq.htm


    Is this relationship linear?
    If the friction area is halved so is the friction?
     
    karl, Nov 21, 2005
    #1
  2. karl

    Steve Mackie Guest

    Typically 50% of the torque is used to overcome friction
    The coefficient of friction does not change, but the friction force does.
     
    Steve Mackie, Nov 21, 2005
    #2
  3. If I understand what they are saying, the smaller radius results in less
    rotational friction, which would be a linear relationship with respect to
    parasitic torque. That is, if the original torque was 50% on the threads and
    50% on the bolt head, cutting the radius in half would cause only 25% of the
    torque to be used to overcome bolt head friction and would put the remaining
    75% of the torque on the threads.

    Note that this is not the area but the radius that is changed. In theory,
    friction is independent of area. What they seem to be describing is
    leverage.

    Mike
     
    Michael Pardee, Nov 21, 2005
    #3
  4. karl

    Ron M. Guest

    'Frictional Force' is calculated by multiplying the coefficient of friction
    times the normal force. Normal force is the perpendicular force in a system.
    It can be quite difficult to determine the correct coefficient of friction
    to utilize when there is plating involved, two different types of materials,
    etc.
    This same problem is why some of these highway patrolmen's estimates of a
    car's speed that was involved in an accident can be total b.s. Many factors
    such as road film, tire condition, loose gravel and brake conditions should
    be taken into account, technically, and there's simply no way that this
    could be calculated accurately at the scene of an accident.

    Ron M.
     
    Ron M., Nov 22, 2005
    #4
  5. karl

    karl Guest


    Actually, neither the coefficient of friction nor the friction force
    does change. See my next message to Michael Pardee.
     
    karl, Nov 22, 2005
    #5
  6. karl

    karl Guest


    Got it. It is the integral of the travel. That is, friction at the bolt
    head (washer) is proportional to,

    friction = D(l)^2/2 - D(s)^2/2

    D(s) = small diameter
    D(l) = large diameter

    Note that D(l) is the smaller of bolt head diameter or large diameter
    of the washer.
     
    karl, Nov 22, 2005
    #6
  7. As karl clarifies, the linear friction is indeed constant, whatever it is.
    It is the translation of that into angular resistance (torque) that varies
    proportionally with the radius (diameter).

    Mike
     
    Michael Pardee, Nov 22, 2005
    #7
  8. karl

    karl Guest


    This is wrong, it relates to the area. But relevant is the length of
    the travel. Friction then is proportional to,

    friction = D(l) - D(s)

    I hope I got it right this time.
     
    karl, Nov 22, 2005
    #8
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