Engine won't turn

Hi,
I have a 91 Honda civic. Once in a while (maybe once a month), the engine
won't turn, although the battery is charged. The lights come on, but nothing
happens when I turn the ignition on. I let it sit overnight, it works just
fine the next day. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

My guess is a "dead spot " on the starter armature or bad solenoid that is
intermittently failing. Eventually it will die and you are looking at a new
starter (the solenoid is included in the starter). You could pull it and
have it checked but may just get the same answer "it seemed to work this
time" or just wait it out until it is dead dead. wolf

 

So have someone watch the lights while you try to start it.
If the lights dim, the starter is drawing current and you have a bad
connection in the battery to starter circuit. Loosen the battery
terminals, rotate them back and forth a little and retighten. Check
the battery ground strap where it is connected at the other end, and
the cable connection at the starter.

If the lights don't dim, the fault may be in the ignition switch or
the starter solenoid, or even a loose fuse. Or it could be the bad
spot on the starter motor's commutator that Wolfgang mentions.
Do you hear a click when you turn the key to start?

 

Thanks for the advice.
Lights don't dim and I don't hear a clicking from the solenoid. I hear the
fuel pump though.

 

The solenoid isn't closing then. Wiggling the key back and forth from
run to start several times may help. If it does, change the ignition
switch. Check connections to the starter solenoid. Check for loose
fuses.

Loose fuses can be fixed thusly:
http://www3.telus.net/public/johnings/faq.html#loosefuses

 

Thanks I appreciate it.

 

I'm not sure of exactly what you mean by "nothing happens," but a failing
distributor coil is notorious for intermittent starting (especially on circa
1990 Hondas), where a successful start occurs after letting the car sit a few
hours. The latter is what happened with my 1991 Civic last year.

http://www.crx.org/southcal/tech/igniter/coil-testing.htm has some clues on
testing the distributor coil.

 

The engine won't turn at all, as if the battery is not there.

 

Have you tried the old "beat the starter with a hammer" method when it
won't start?

I'm not joking. It's worked for me in the past when my starter was
going...

Adam

 

That works by jarring the rotor a little bit so the dead segment of
the comutator slips out from under the brush. It can also jar loose a
sticking brush. In Sean's situation however, his solenoid isn't even
closing so the starter never gets any power.

 

Tell me about!!! Mine usually took upto about an hour depending
on air temperature. I can almost handle that.

Happened to me last night but it wasn't a one hour stay, it was
all evening - five hours in the open on my host's drive - and at
1:00am it wasn't going to start! It has never done that before.
He ran me home and at midday today picked me up and I tried
it again and it started! So it is back here now and I've asked the
local parts and accessories shop to get one in for me and I'll
change it out.

I'll have a look in a little while, thanks.

 

Next time I will actually read the subject line. ;-)

Updates are welcome. It seems relatively rare to read here that the cause of a
circa 1990 Honda no-start was other than either (1) something
distributor-related; (2) the main fuel relay; or (3) the timing belt.

But exceptions to these three causes are reported and helpful to all. I'd
certainly be trying the suggestions others posted here...

 

Well, I put the new coil in and there is no difference. It still won't
start
when hot and needs an hour or more to cool.

I'm going to polish the distributor cap next with a little beeswax
like I did before and see if that is the key to this problem.

[To re-iterate, it cold starts fine and runs with full power available
for the first two miles. As it warms up, heavy throttle at low revs
causes misfires but as the revs increase to, say, 2500 rpm it is
less inclined to misfire at heavy throttle use. Starting the engine
after a brief shopping stop will likely fail and require 'sitting it out'
for an hour or two before it deems to co-operate! ]

 

When it's not starting, is the fuel pump running for a few seconds
when you turn the key?

 

Yes, John, it is - and it is always the same tone I hear (meaning the
same rpm of the pump.)

But - I think I've fixed it! It was the distributor cap. I cleaned it up
thoroughly by washing it in hot washing up water and Fairy Liquid.
Wiping it dry. Then polished it up with a paper towel and a smear
of Silicon Grease to seal the out side and inside surfaces and to
act as a water repellant. This is similar to what I did when the igniter
module packed in and as I reported in the article on my website
in the Miscellanea section. (Yes, it is a Rover with a Honda 1.6l
16v SOHC PGM-FI engine.) The strange thing is that there didn't
seem to be any film on the inside. There was no sign of any tracking
which was also the case previously.

I got two plug leads swapped over with each other when I re-fitted
the cap in the dark, but it didn't prevent the engine from starting and
running on two cylinders and it didn't threaten to stop.

I've done two warm restarts but there's a lot of traffic around and I'm
in need of food so I'll do more confirming tests tomorrow and report
back.

 

Here's that report - IT'S FIXED! I went out and about today trying
to catch up with things and the starting was perfect everytime. No
missed beats during heavy throttle at low rpms either.

I've got a new set of plug leads and a new set of plugs to put in.
But - the leads on there at the moment are almost impossible to
pull off! I can only get at No.1 plug; the others, I fear, will break
before they let go of the plug nipple. Has anyone any suggestions
what to do here, please?

 

Twist them (holding the boot, not the wire) and they should break loose so
you can pull them off.

 

Thanks, I'll try that. But there's a good chance that the outer cap and
bakelite tube will slip before the plug shroud breaks loose. The main
problem is that the nipple clip is very tight and not very springy.

 

I have now updated my website with results of my endeavours
in the 'Miscellanea' section. I have removed parts which were
hypothetical and postulations. 8¬)

(I've yet to change the plugs but I've got a set of new leads so
I'll not cry if an old one breaks when I try to get it off).

Thanks again to all who helped.