[QUOTE] Sorry, I am going to join in on the bashing of Consumer Reports reliability rankings. They are worthless. For one thing they cover too short a time. JD Power survey seems practically fraudulent as they rank "initial quality"...ie, defects when delivered...while that is nice...it doesn't tell you if the transmission falls out at 6,000 miles. Go to a very busy independent mechanic and ask him what breaks the least and don't forget to get an opinion on how relatively expensive the replacement parts are, you will be surprised. Second best ask a lot of people who would qualify as "car enthusiasts" and ask them for their experiences. I wish I knew of a good place to find reliability rankings with published criteria that I could believe in. If anyone does know of one please tell me. . Norm[/QUOTE] Just write your own. That should serve you quite well, and you'll be very satisfied with how bright you think the author is. There's no need to be sorry about bashing the Consumer Reports reliability rankings; you join a large company of people who choose to do so because the rankings don't agree with what they already 'believe'. Relax. In the meantime, those of us who value consumer input rather than manufacturer's claims will continue to use this and other measures for evaluation. Of course, I have no way of knowing for sure that other people who rate their purchases for reliability do so fairly and honestly, anymore than you or the other cretins have any way of knowing that they do not. We do know that there's nothing to gain by not doing so, and the reliability of the Hondas and Toyotas which have topped the reliability rankings for years and years isn't disputed by anyone with two brain cells to rub together - or by anyone with data to back up the disputation. By the way, Consumer Reports covers at least six years of history. For my Hondas, that's about 120,000 miles. Each. A shitload more than enough to tell you if the transmission falls out at 6000 miles. RFT!!! Dave Kelsen