Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?

you're "uncomfortable" with it? fly by wire has been used in civilian
planes since concorde first flew in 1969. maybe before for all i know.
all the fud that surrounds fly by wire is the bleating of
johnny-come-lately's like boeing who have had their lunch eaten because
they're too damned slow off the blocks. you can bet that if boeing were
there first, all the fud would be about "old mechanical systems".

want another example? look at arianne. they've just launched a 10 ton
payload into geosynchronous orbit. what do /we/ have that can do that
these days? the shuttle? what a joke. /american/ companies are going
to the /french/ to launch their satellites? that's ridiculous.

seriously, we've taken our eye off the aerospace ball big time.
bleating about the technology won't help us get back on track. we need
a massive re-commitment to aerospace, a MASSIVE re-commitment to science
and engineering in schools [ELIMINATING GRADE INFLATION] and to take
some initiatives for a change. right now, we're trying to play catch-up
after tossing stones from off-field.

 

******What significant performance, control, and reliability benefits do you
see from the by-wire system ( as it has been defined as applying to the
Honda
application)?

 

******What significant performance, control, and reliability benefits do you
see from the by-wire system ( as it has been defined as applying to the
Honda
application)?

 

I wouldn't worry about not having a mechanical connection.

We have had electronic throttles for a long time with very few
problems. We have also had hydraulic brakes since the 1930's with very
very few problems of total failure.

 

I wouldn't worry about not having a mechanical connection.

We have had electronic throttles for a long time with very few
problems. We have also had hydraulic brakes since the 1930's with very
very few problems of total failure.

 

i disagree. while in an ideal world, driver training would be perfect,
it's never going to be. go sit with my grandmother as she drives her
crown vic. "why are you sweating? - the air conditioner's on max". no
kidding grandma.

reality is, vehicles need to take account of the "average" driver. i
personally dislike abs because it doesn't offer me choices on my braking
limits. but for my grandmother, it's the /only/ way to go - there's no
amount of driver training will /ever/ get her up to a standard that
would ever allow her to steer out of a skid or have /any/ chance of
fighting wheel lift in an suv. i therefore say that while /you/ may
feel you can control an suv competently, it's unrealistic to expect
everyone else to approach the standard necessary. the only responsible
approach is [and i hate to say this] do what the europeans do and go for
active stability control on suv's. that vehicle platform is just not
capable of being "safe" without it.

 

i disagree. while in an ideal world, driver training would be perfect,
it's never going to be. go sit with my grandmother as she drives her
crown vic. "why are you sweating? - the air conditioner's on max". no
kidding grandma.

reality is, vehicles need to take account of the "average" driver. i
personally dislike abs because it doesn't offer me choices on my braking
limits. but for my grandmother, it's the /only/ way to go - there's no
amount of driver training will /ever/ get her up to a standard that
would ever allow her to steer out of a skid or have /any/ chance of
fighting wheel lift in an suv. i therefore say that while /you/ may
feel you can control an suv competently, it's unrealistic to expect
everyone else to approach the standard necessary. the only responsible
approach is [and i hate to say this] do what the europeans do and go for
active stability control on suv's. that vehicle platform is just not
capable of being "safe" without it.

 

you're tooling along at 20% throttle, 2k rpm. you want to accelerate
and go to 100% throttle. but your engine's only good for wot above 4k
rpm. you need to shift. but it's a stick and you don't. but you do
get some pull up to about 60% throttle. why throw away 40% that's not
being utilized? electronic control saves you gas.

ok, so you don't drive a stick, but you have an old hydraulic automatic.
again, you want to go up a steepish hill and because it won't pull at
low rpm's, you need the transmission to shift. it won't until you kick
it to the floor because the transmission can't detect load, only whether
you've operated the kickdown. sure, you can manualy over-ride, but why?
electronic controls know exactly the engine load and can therefore
determine the grade of hill. selection of gear ratio and throttle
position is /much/ better.

besides, what's with this misconception that we need direct throttle
linkage? anyone here ever worked on diesels? anyone here know that the
diesel govenor does? there's no direct linkage to fuel injection on a
diesel - it's all done by the govenor. if that thing fails, you have
ZERO engine control. diesels have been like this from day 1.

 

you're tooling along at 20% throttle, 2k rpm. you want to accelerate
and go to 100% throttle. but your engine's only good for wot above 4k
rpm. you need to shift. but it's a stick and you don't. but you do
get some pull up to about 60% throttle. why throw away 40% that's not
being utilized? electronic control saves you gas.

ok, so you don't drive a stick, but you have an old hydraulic automatic.
again, you want to go up a steepish hill and because it won't pull at
low rpm's, you need the transmission to shift. it won't until you kick
it to the floor because the transmission can't detect load, only whether
you've operated the kickdown. sure, you can manualy over-ride, but why?
electronic controls know exactly the engine load and can therefore
determine the grade of hill. selection of gear ratio and throttle
position is /much/ better.

besides, what's with this misconception that we need direct throttle
linkage? anyone here ever worked on diesels? anyone here know that the
diesel govenor does? there's no direct linkage to fuel injection on a
diesel - it's all done by the govenor. if that thing fails, you have
ZERO engine control. diesels have been like this from day 1.

 

Thereby leaving you more time to talk on your cellphone!
--scott

 

Thereby leaving you more time to talk on your cellphone!
--scott

 

I stand corrected. Thanks for clearing that up.

nb

 

I stand corrected. Thanks for clearing that up.

nb

 

Zero to five volts.

Toyota MDT in MO

 

Zero to five volts.

Toyota MDT in MO

 

">> The idea of full-on "steer by wire" with NO mechanical

As I understand it, electric steering is "electric power assisted" steering.
That it, instead of the tradtional hydraulic assist system, there are
electrical-mechanical assists (stepper motors maybe come to mind) to the
standard rack and pinion.

Stewart DIBBS

 

">> The idea of full-on "steer by wire" with NO mechanical

As I understand it, electric steering is "electric power assisted" steering.
That it, instead of the tradtional hydraulic assist system, there are
electrical-mechanical assists (stepper motors maybe come to mind) to the
standard rack and pinion.

Stewart DIBBS

 

Wrong. Remember the vacuum operated modulator valve? They worked great
until the diaphram broke and ATF got sucked into the engine. Those were
the days, man, those were the days....

sure, you can manualy over-ride, but why?

 

Wrong. Remember the vacuum operated modulator valve? They worked great
until the diaphram broke and ATF got sucked into the engine. Those were
the days, man, those were the days....

sure, you can manualy over-ride, but why?

 

Few use manual transmissions now, and even if they did, the 'by wire'
technology
would not change a thing.

Even with diesels, 'by wire' actuation does nothing unique.

IF automated highways ever became a reality, then a totally electronic
system
might be the way to go...collision avoidance, route selection, traffic flow
optimization,
police interception, etc...all might be controlled by computer...

I think I will stay home if that ever happens...