Honda, Toyota, or Lexus?

I currently own a 2000 Toyota Avalon XLS and am looking for new wheels
(and the rest of the car to go with it). I have been happy with Ava
and looked at the new Toyota Avalon, Camry, and the Honda Accord. I
haven't looked at the Lexus ES350 yet because the dealership is about
a 2 hour drive from here. The reviews look good.

My initial conclusion is they all look good. The Toyota / Lexus are
somewhat quieter and smoother, the Honda probably more reliable.

I hear that Toyota quality and reliability is slipping and the 6 speed
transmission used in all the cars that I am considering has problems.
How serious are they? The Lexus seems nice but I am being told that
it must be taken to the Lexus dealer for warranty repairs, a 4 hour
drive round trip. Is this true, or can the local Toyota dealer handle
it?

I considered the Acura TL, but it does not come with cloth seats. The
Honda dealer was pushing the Nissan Altima. I don't think they are as
reliable as the Toyota. I recently rented Nissan Sentra for 2 months
in Hawaii. In 2 months due to failures we drove 3 different ones and
were not impressed. Any other suggestions for a nicer car that comes
with cloth seats?

 

Forget all that crap and just get a BMW 5-series.

 

Feh... I've had three of them. The 95 and 98 540, I liked. The 01 530 was
a piece of crap. Constant problems with the computer and electrical system.
Glad it was a lease and I could get rid of it after 36 months.

With the possible exception of cornering, the Acura TL is a much better car
and about $15,000 less.

 

Funny, I went through the exact same drill last year when replacing my '00
Avalon...

I didn't like the new Avalon (so much plastic and shiny stuff on them looked
like they were designed by a 20-something engineer on drugs), same reaction
to the Solara convertible, just couldn't get comfortable in the Camry seats,
liked the Acura TL but damned if I'll put premium gas in one of those beasts
and the price was higher than I wanted to spend on my ride--- so I ended up
getting an Accord V6 EX-L--- by default really. Kinda settled for it when I
bought it.

But after driving it for several months, I've really come to like and
appreciate this car. It handles great ("corners like it's on rails"), has
plenty of power, is fun to drive, the shape of the seats exactly match the
shape of my ass, didn't care about the sunroof and XM radio-- but have come
to really enjoy them, has had zero assembly defects--- and I just got back
from a 650 mile trip and got 33.4 MPG!!

 

A German car?

Better he should just buy a GM car and keep the money somewhat in this
country. He gets the same build quality, anyway.

 

Yeah. They're the best at making cars. Simple as that.

Oh, but buying a Toyota or Honda is just fine, eh? Did you not know that
those are Japanese-owned car companies? You think the money stays here in
this country when you buy a Toyota or a Honda?

The build quality is NOT the same either, by the way.

 

Yeah. They're the best at making cars. Simple as that.[/QUOTE]

Hardly.

 

IMO, the 2008 Avalon comes out better than the Honda. Big surprise is that
it's gas mileage is up in the 26-28 mpg range.
MLD

 

HIghway? City? With a 6 or a 4?

 

V6 and around the city. On a 3000 mi trip averaged 27/28 and at times did
between 30/31. On the trip just about all highway and anywhere between
75-80 mph

 

Mercedes used to be one of the most reliable cars on the road (we're
talking 30 years ago now.) Now it is one of the least reliable.
VW/Audi are just about as bad. Compared to them the BMW is stellar,
but really not in the same league as Honda or Toyota.

BMWs are fun to drive, but you pay a lot for it when you buy it and as
you go down the road.

 

This is very true. I was looking at a used 2005 325i and being used to
Hondas/Hyundai's and how reliable they have been, I was shocked to see
some common issues that the 325's all had.

1) Transmissions failing at under 100k miles and BMW doing nothing
about it.(This was the dealbreaker)
2) Thermostats failing at 60k and then again at 80k
3) Balljoints failing at 80k
4) VANOS problems (BMW's Variable Timing)
5) Radiator expansion tank

And the list went on and on...If I wanted a car that had all of these
problems I would get a Ford. The Germans tried following the Japanese
way of doing things and they have failed miserably.

 

BMW, Honda, Hyundai, Nissan and Toyota have factories in the US and employ
US citizens and pay US taxes.

 

This is what I usually get with my V6 Accord ('04).

 

Right. You're as clueless as the other dumbass.

 

Why is he clueless?

 

Are you saying that these companies do not manufacture within US borders and
they do not employ American citizens?

 

Probably because I'm right.

 

Believe the 3 series is assembled in Pretoria, South Africa and shipped to
the States. The engines and transmissions are made in Germany.

 

No.

What I was referring to was the blanket-statement that "the money stays
here in the US" when buying one of these cars. Perhaps *some* of it does,
but not all. In fact that was never the point of the original discussion
at all.

<shrug>