Hybrid War: Honda vs Toyota

The back/tail end, AFAIK, is what constitutes the Kamm back. Not the entire
general shape.

Cathy

 

Yes, going to be interesting...

Cathy

 

Well, no. There's a mathematical description of the shape, in which the
butt truncation occurs where its cross-sectional area is equal to a
specific percentage of the maximum cross section of the vehicle (about
half, I think). It's the gestalt - the whole car.

Ike

Increasingly dubious that anyone, including Saint Barack, has any chance
whatsoever of avoiding an economic collapse, rampant inflation, and
sociological cataclysm.

 

You know what...? Whichever it is technically, I do not think the original
Insight resembled the new one, nor the Prius (which the new Insight does
resemble - shape-wise). And... why would Honda even *want* the new Insight
to resemble the old one, considering how that one fared? They need a fresh
new start with this version, which I think they're getting.

Cathy

 

The Insight's electric motor provides 13 HP compared to 67 HP for the
Prius. That has a major impact on city driving with regenerative
braking less able to recover energy while stopping.

The original Insight used aluminum extensively to lower weight and
improve crashworthiness.

 

On Mar 30, 10:36 am, "rtc" <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]

This weekend I rented a 2009 Prius (Basic) to validate
what since now I have had only read about.


I drove the Prius on suburban roads and for
a brief time I tested it out on a 6 lane super
highway. At high speeds the cabin
was a slightly noisy .

The joystick-parking button drive mode gave me strangest feeling
of all the really big differences - rather than have a different
position
for each drive mode (R,N,D,P,B) the joystick position normally is
in only one position and moving the joystick in a particular direction
(up, down, right, left) selects a drive mode. However, in order for
that drive mode to be selected the driver must press the brake
pedal (like a manual transmission clutch) to change the drive
mode - and to park one needs to press a park button. The motion
was not easy for me and there was no positive feel with
the joystick - so I found myself constantly looking at the
LED display to determine if I was in the correct drive mode.

Using the energy display, it was fairly easy to get the Prius to
average between 45 to 55 mpg. However, the energy displays
position in the center of the car is somewhat distracting.
I would have preferred an *energy* display next to speedometer
display (one led for battery recharging, one led for gasoline engine
drive on, one led for eletric engine drive on, and a real-time
Led MPG gauge )

The Prius really shines when it comes to maximizing fuel
efficiency. The hints that I had read on hypermiling with
the Prius came in handy - e.g. tapping the brake
pedals before an anticipate stop helps initiate the battery
recharging earlier than if the computer were to initiate it. Also
getting the car up to speed quickly and then letting go of the
accelerator to cut off the gas engine and then slightly pressing
the accelerator to try to the electric motor to maintain the
speed on a downhill or flat road helps push up the MPGs.
However, for sudden short stop-and-go traffic and driving
uphill - the Prius mpg suffered (also I've read that the
Prius MPG also suffers when it is really cold. ISTM the
Prius can get over 50 mpg when it is driven in warm dry
weather over relatively flat roads over long distances
with few stops ). If one is driving in very agressive highway
environment or short trips that are have a great deal of
stop and go traffic - it would be difficult for a driver to
modify their driving to get the optimum fuel efficiency
from the 2009 Prius.

I found the fuel gauge is not a linear indicator of how much
fuel is left in the Prius. The Prius is suppose to have a 11.9 gallon
fuel *bladder" ; when the Prius is down to its last 3 gallons a
low fuel gauge warning light is suppose to go on. The fuel gauge
has 10 led segments when it was down to three led segments
I filled it with 3 gallons - but it only raised the fuel gauge to
4 led segments - so then I filled it with 3 more gallons which
then increase the fuel gauge setting to 10 led segments
(initially when I got car from the rental office - the fuel gauge
was at five led segments (1/2 way full marker) .

The sunlight had a tendency to washout the LCD screen
it would have been easier to read if the LCD screen had some
sun visor over top of it.

Not all of the buttons and dials on the dashboard and on the steering
wheel
don't light up (at night) making them harder to find them in the
dark. . The volume
dial and the seek button are too close to each other.

If the back of front passenger seat was shorter or if there was
slightty
more distant between the backseat and the front passenger seat
one might be able to take off the front passenger seat head rest
and push the back of the front passenger seat all the way down
(like the honda fit) and fit a very long object in the passenger
side...
With the front passenger seat pushed forward all the way and the
rear seats folded down - the maximum cargo length is abou 6.25 feet.
maximum cargo height is about 2.4 feet and the maximum cargo
width is from 3.25 to 4.feet.

The Prius isn't a very fast car - so merging into a superhighway
is its weakest trait.

I've also read that the Prius' low rolling friction
tires don't perform that well in rain and snow....

Lastly, the Prius as well as probably all non SUV hybrids
doesn't have any towing capacity. The total weight of the
driver, passengers, and cargo in the Prius (Vehicle Capacity
Weight) is not suppose to be over 810 pounds.

 

Considering that there is only one drive mode, you're always in the
correct drive mode. "B" is not a drive mode, and shouldn't be used
except when driving on a long downhill. It took me less than an hour
for that selector to become second nature.

One can change the display to something else, or even turn it off
completely.

That's coming with the 2010 model. In fact, the center display screen
will be gone completely unless you have the GPS navigation package.

True, but it still gets better mileage under those conditions than other
cars do, because their mileage suffers as well.

As do all internal-combustion engines.

True, but the same is also true of other cars.

That's true of all gas gauges, but the bladder makes it more so with the
Prius; the bladder is in only the US versions of the car, BTW.

The bladder will be gone with the 2010 model.

That's because the LCD screen is polarized for left-hand drive. It's
been a sore point for many drivers who have right-and drive models.

Actually, all the ones on the steering wheel do, but they're not bright
enough. The ones on the dash that don't light up are rarely used.

I've never had a problem with that; the car can go up to over 100 MPH,
and I've found acceleration to be very brisk. It's not a muscle car,
but it is peppy enough to not have any merge problems. I'm up to
highway speed by the time I reach the end of the onramp, before I am in
the merge lane.

 

Ummmmm.....actually, one needs press the brake pedal only to shift OUT
of park.

Not sure what you THINK you had to do, but if you were pressing the
brake pedal to shift from D to N or B, you were doing it wrong.

What else were you doing wrong?

I read that too--and yet, I went through 40K miles and two winters
without a hint of problem. Go figure.

 

Not me. After the first 20K the tires were useless on ice and snow.

 

Why does it have to be a war?
Under new mileage laws most vehicles will need hybrid technology
next decade.
Plus $5 - $10 gasoline WILL return in a matter of time.
Better to work the bugs out now before get into high volumes.

 

In message

Here in the UK we already pay over £4 a gallon what's that in your
money?

 

At first glance, that would be $5.93, but a British gallon is larger
than a US gallon so the UK price would be $5.00 per US gallon.

 

A little under $6.00. Doesn't that higher tax pay for your health care too?
If we added our health care costs to our gas costs we would be paying about
$10.00 gallon right now.

 

Elmo P. Shagnasty schreef:

When I backup from my driveway I switch from R to D without even
touching my brake. It works very smoothly. Only if you switch from N or
P to any drive mode you have to press the brake pedal, just like any
other automatic.
Thibaud

 

It reached $8 last year before the Pound tumbled.

 

I only had a 30 second review of the operations of the Prius from
the rental agency - so initially what I knew was from the internet.
Luckily - there was an owner's manual in glove compartment
and I spent some time reading that on the second day I had
the car. Renting a Prius was a great way to learn more about
the it - I wish I could rent an Insight too ( but I don't think that
opportunity will arise atleast not locally where I live).

I think user manual should have spent more time explaining their
unique drive mode shifter - which I think was different enough from
standard transmission systems to warrant more space in the
user manual

However, even after reading the manual, I found that when I
I was getting the car out of park I would occasionally
shift it into drive when I meant to shift it into reverse. - and vice
versa. It was only when I focus on the blue LED display
that I could consistently do it right.

I'm not sure whether to believe or discount what I've
been reading on the internet. However, it did freak me
out and when it was raining last saturday - i didn't
drive the prius.... I should have driven it in the rain
maybe in a empty parking lot to test the braking
in the rain - but I chickened out.

 

thanks for replying to my posting it was very informative.

hmm... considering that CVT and hybrids are
the wave of the future - I hope all this becomes
second nature to me soon...

True
But -- I found myself constantly glancing at the energy
display to see how I could drive more efficiently.
I suppose as one racks up more experience with the Prius,
there is no need to view energy display.

Even so - I really wish the Prius had an an accurate 3/4 1/2 and 1/4
mark
indicators on the gasoline gauge.

Another cool software option might be an overall
Consumption Screen that would show the consumption of gas and
the mileage achieved since the last gas fill up so you could ask
whether it was really worth it to fill up with premium gas?.

What didn't light up that I would have really like to have lite up at
night:
the power side mirror control buttons on the driver's door, the dial
controlling the air vents (maybe green glow-in-the-dark plastic
dials?) ,
the horn button on the steering wheel.

Where I would have liked led lights - inside the driver's center
console compartment (to identify where that plug is ),
I would have also like more preset buttons for the radio on the
touch screen radio control panel -

If I had more time with the prius I would have like to
study the climate control more.

my experience....
When merging into I-270 ( a maryland super highway) there
was a dozen vehicles going at 65 miles per hour all driving
with about three car lengths between each of them - When
accelerating the Prius up to 60 to 65 miles per hour on the merging
lane to parallel to the right lane it seems that some vehicles
these were *speeding up* just to try to make it more difficult
for the prius to merge into the right lane ..

The owner manual warned not to drive faster than 85mph
which is the maximum speed the car's tires are rated for.

 

@c36g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>, ()
says...

I've driven the Prius with the stock Goodyear Integrity tires in
torrential rain at highway speeds, as well as winding secondary roads,
and never had a problem.

 

@k38g2000yqh.googlegroups.com>, ()
says...

The Prius shifter is neither a CVT nor a hybrid thing... it's a Prius
thing.

I use the energy/consumption display all the time, and it's no more of a
distraction than any other gauge. All it requires is an occasional
glance, which is no different than checking your mirrors.

The consumption screen shows MPG since last reset, and miles since last
fill-up. If you hit [Reset] at each fill-up, then you'll have your
overall MPG for the last tank.

Filling up with premium will not gain you anything, except for a lighter
wallet.

 

That was my experience--down to the "torrential rain" thing, not to
mention a couple decent winters.

Mine's a company car; when they changed out the OEM tires a few weeks
ago and put on some God-knows-what things, my mileage dropped like a
rock. Hint: the Prius is a carefully engineered system, down to the
tires. Change out anything, including the tires, and you break the
system. Want to keep the mileage up? Keep with the Integritys (or
similar tires designed for high fuel efficiency using low rolling
resistance design).