new Honda CR-V break in

How can all the still serviceable oil drained not be wasted?

I agree with you philosophically, i.e, I do what I want with my $$$, you
do what you want with yours, etc.; but we're subject to irrational
choices. I've lost the link from a couple of years ago, but there was a
study done showing that the ancient wisdom of changing oil every 3,000
miles was way too soon for modern engines and modern engine oil.

Quite so, but no proof you're not spending more than you have to,
throwing out/recycling perfectly usable engine oil or keeping your fleet
vehicles off the road more time than they require.

 

How can all the still serviceable oil drained not be wasted?

I agree with you philosophically, i.e, I do what I want with my $$$, you
do what you want with yours, etc.; but we're subject to irrational
choices. I've lost the link from a couple of years ago, but there was a
study done showing that the ancient wisdom of changing oil every 3,000
miles was way too soon for modern engines and modern engine oil.

Quite so, but no proof you're not spending more than you have to,
throwing out/recycling perfectly usable engine oil or keeping your fleet
vehicles off the road more time than they require.

 

Thanks, Jim, in extending my change interval I've been sending samples
of engine oil to a lab for analysis. So far oil condition is good, no
signs of engine wear, etc. The one thing I do counter to the manual is
to change the engine air filter on my '03 Accord annually instead of
every other year.

 

Thanks, Jim, in extending my change interval I've been sending samples
of engine oil to a lab for analysis. So far oil condition is good, no
signs of engine wear, etc. The one thing I do counter to the manual is
to change the engine air filter on my '03 Accord annually instead of
every other year.

 

Posting on usenet is a waste of time and money also so wasting time and
money cant be the real issue.

` Do you worry about how often other people take a piss, or whether
they are washing their hands too often or that they are breathing too
fast.? These actions serve the same purpose as changing oil but for some
reason you are not constantly telling others how often they should be
engaging in these other activities that serve the same function of
cleansing the system. If someone said they change the air in their tires
every 3 months would you get all bent out of shape about it? This is a
serious mental deficiency some people have that they are completely and
totally obsessed with how often other people change oil.

In my opinion anybody who incessantly worries about other peoples oil
change habits are just perverted busy bodies.

That is utter nonsense. Oil analysis is like reading tea leaves in the
bottom of a cup. Major engine manufacturers like Cummins say oil
analysis is of very little value in determining oil maintenance
schedules. The reasoning is that oil analysis only tells you how much
dirt is in the oil. But if the oil additives are depleted the oil will
hold less dirt and that is where extended oil changes can get you into
trouble. Oil analysis does not accurately provide the information needed
to determine engine longevity. According to Cummins the only way you are
going to know if your lubrication maintenance schedule has been
aggressive enough (or not aggressive enough) is at the end of the road
when you tear the engine down for an overhaul. Fleet mechanics that
maintain many engines get to see what works and what doesn't.

It is easy to determine if an engine has had the oil changed often
enough. Not so easy to exactly determine at what point it will make a
difference.

He has the same facts you do. He may be a lot smarter than you if he
realizes that no one has all the facts or can get all the facts.

It would be you that is the ignorant one. Some people just don't
understand that you can't possibly predict all the consequences of every
action. The best you can do is play the odds.

I read recently in this newsgroup about some guy who had a large hole
burned in an exhaust valve. There is one and only one thing that can
cause a valve to burn like that and that is a chunk of carbon breaks
loose from inside the combustion chamber and just happens to be passing
through as the exhaust valve is closing. This is a rare occurrence that
a chunk of carbon gets trapped in a a exhaust valve but it does happen.
Is this something that is more likely to happen to someone who changes
their oil at 6000 miles compared to someone who changes at 3000 miles?
There is absolutely no doubt that will change the odds.

-jim

 

Posting on usenet is a waste of time and money also so wasting time and
money cant be the real issue.

` Do you worry about how often other people take a piss, or whether
they are washing their hands too often or that they are breathing too
fast.? These actions serve the same purpose as changing oil but for some
reason you are not constantly telling others how often they should be
engaging in these other activities that serve the same function of
cleansing the system. If someone said they change the air in their tires
every 3 months would you get all bent out of shape about it? This is a
serious mental deficiency some people have that they are completely and
totally obsessed with how often other people change oil.

In my opinion anybody who incessantly worries about other peoples oil
change habits are just perverted busy bodies.

That is utter nonsense. Oil analysis is like reading tea leaves in the
bottom of a cup. Major engine manufacturers like Cummins say oil
analysis is of very little value in determining oil maintenance
schedules. The reasoning is that oil analysis only tells you how much
dirt is in the oil. But if the oil additives are depleted the oil will
hold less dirt and that is where extended oil changes can get you into
trouble. Oil analysis does not accurately provide the information needed
to determine engine longevity. According to Cummins the only way you are
going to know if your lubrication maintenance schedule has been
aggressive enough (or not aggressive enough) is at the end of the road
when you tear the engine down for an overhaul. Fleet mechanics that
maintain many engines get to see what works and what doesn't.

It is easy to determine if an engine has had the oil changed often
enough. Not so easy to exactly determine at what point it will make a
difference.

He has the same facts you do. He may be a lot smarter than you if he
realizes that no one has all the facts or can get all the facts.

It would be you that is the ignorant one. Some people just don't
understand that you can't possibly predict all the consequences of every
action. The best you can do is play the odds.

I read recently in this newsgroup about some guy who had a large hole
burned in an exhaust valve. There is one and only one thing that can
cause a valve to burn like that and that is a chunk of carbon breaks
loose from inside the combustion chamber and just happens to be passing
through as the exhaust valve is closing. This is a rare occurrence that
a chunk of carbon gets trapped in a a exhaust valve but it does happen.
Is this something that is more likely to happen to someone who changes
their oil at 6000 miles compared to someone who changes at 3000 miles?
There is absolutely no doubt that will change the odds.

-jim

 

It isn't considered "still serviceable" oil. It is used and then used
by others to fuel their shop furnace. So it is well used.

Mileage isn't the only factor involved when setting oil change
frequency. We have operating hours which come into play in the equation
as well.

The proof is in the corporate books, which show that less money is
being spent on the maintenance of the fleet since I took over the
company's operation, than my predecessor's performance. The fleet is
serviced during the night shift, which keeps the fleet on the road
during the day when they are required to be there.

 

It isn't considered "still serviceable" oil. It is used and then used
by others to fuel their shop furnace. So it is well used.

Mileage isn't the only factor involved when setting oil change
frequency. We have operating hours which come into play in the equation
as well.

The proof is in the corporate books, which show that less money is
being spent on the maintenance of the fleet since I took over the
company's operation, than my predecessor's performance. The fleet is
serviced during the night shift, which keeps the fleet on the road
during the day when they are required to be there.

 

All this says is that it appears to take an unspecified time for some of
the anti-wear chemistry to 'activate.' They don't speculate, much less
offer data, regarding the time, temp, mileage, etc. required to do so.
It may take 20 miles, or 200. Depending on your driving habits and
conditions, changing your oil every day may indeed be counter
productive. Every 1000 miles? Maybe not.

 

All this says is that it appears to take an unspecified time for some of
the anti-wear chemistry to 'activate.' They don't speculate, much less
offer data, regarding the time, temp, mileage, etc. required to do so.
It may take 20 miles, or 200. Depending on your driving habits and
conditions, changing your oil every day may indeed be counter
productive. Every 1000 miles? Maybe not.

 

so why remain in ignorance? get oil analysis done! it's neither hard
nor expensive!

or to put it another way - you use the fuel gauge on your dash don't
you? it tells you how much gas you have in the tank doesn't it? wtf
wouldn't anyone want to know how much life they have left in the oil in
their multi-thousand dollar transportation device?

 

so why remain in ignorance? get oil analysis done! it's neither hard
nor expensive!

or to put it another way - you use the fuel gauge on your dash don't
you? it tells you how much gas you have in the tank doesn't it? wtf
wouldn't anyone want to know how much life they have left in the oil in
their multi-thousand dollar transportation device?

 

No. You get to choose the line.

 

No. You get to choose the line.

 

How can all the still serviceable oil drained not be wasted?[/QUOTE]

well, you sell it to Jiffy Lube...

 

How can all the still serviceable oil drained not be wasted?[/QUOTE]

well, you sell it to Jiffy Lube...

 

you're right - the issue is someone polluting the knowledge pool with
witchcraft bullshit.

so why are you telling people you "save money" changing your oil so
often??? all the evidence contradicts you, not supports you.

by that metric, you're a goddamned hypocrite. you're preaching your
witchcraft about your oil change intervals so you're a perverted
busybody if you dare to contradict anyone else. not least because you
have no data to back up your position.

eh? so when you change your "fleet" brake linings, do you simply do it
every 3000 miles? 10000 miles? or do you bother to observe actual wear
and change when the pad reaches a given limit? because that's what
you're doing with oil analysis - observing condition and replacing once
it's worn to the limit. replacing it out of superstition and fear is
ridiculous.

bullshit. cite your source.

see, this is the reason you're so dismissive - you clearly don't
understand what it does!

see above.

bullshit. you don't know what you're talking about.

bullshit. the whole point of analysis is that it /does/ tell you what's
going on.

yeah. and fleet mechanics that know what they're doing pay attention to
data sources life service manuals. similarly, fleet managers that know
their business get analysis done because it allows them to not only
ensure efficient maintenance, but also minimize expense!

er, no. you're simply afraid that if you don't sacrifice chickens, your
leg will never heal.

"no one has all the facts or can get all the facts"??? wow dude, that's
a classic. if everybody thought like you, you'd never be able to say
that because you wouldn't have a computer to say it on. unbelievable
ignorance.

witchcraft works!!!

that was me.

bullshit. you clearly don't know what you're talking about. quite a
feat given that the thread you read actually explains the mechanisms
that cause this.

oil changes affect valve burn??? dude, you need to either stop smoking
that shit you're smoking now, or you need to

 

you're right - the issue is someone polluting the knowledge pool with
witchcraft bullshit.

so why are you telling people you "save money" changing your oil so
often??? all the evidence contradicts you, not supports you.

by that metric, you're a goddamned hypocrite. you're preaching your
witchcraft about your oil change intervals so you're a perverted
busybody if you dare to contradict anyone else. not least because you
have no data to back up your position.

eh? so when you change your "fleet" brake linings, do you simply do it
every 3000 miles? 10000 miles? or do you bother to observe actual wear
and change when the pad reaches a given limit? because that's what
you're doing with oil analysis - observing condition and replacing once
it's worn to the limit. replacing it out of superstition and fear is
ridiculous.

bullshit. cite your source.

see, this is the reason you're so dismissive - you clearly don't
understand what it does!

see above.

bullshit. you don't know what you're talking about.

bullshit. the whole point of analysis is that it /does/ tell you what's
going on.

yeah. and fleet mechanics that know what they're doing pay attention to
data sources life service manuals. similarly, fleet managers that know
their business get analysis done because it allows them to not only
ensure efficient maintenance, but also minimize expense!

er, no. you're simply afraid that if you don't sacrifice chickens, your
leg will never heal.

"no one has all the facts or can get all the facts"??? wow dude, that's
a classic. if everybody thought like you, you'd never be able to say
that because you wouldn't have a computer to say it on. unbelievable
ignorance.

witchcraft works!!!

that was me.

bullshit. you clearly don't know what you're talking about. quite a
feat given that the thread you read actually explains the mechanisms
that cause this.

oil changes affect valve burn??? dude, you need to either stop smoking
that shit you're smoking now, or you need to

 

and that's the whole point - you /know/ what's going on - you're not
making erroneous suppositions based on a bunch of bullshit lack of data.

 

and that's the whole point - you /know/ what's going on - you're not
making erroneous suppositions based on a bunch of bullshit lack of data.