Oil Change Frequency

Up until I got my 2009 Civic, I would change oil in my cars every 3K miles.
Now with the car's 'maintenance minder", it shows the oil life left which
is 5-7K miles.

If I REALLY can go by it, I have no problems.

Just asking if it will wear the engine out quicker.

thanks,

 

If you're into recreational oil changing, lock 'n load, it won't hurt --
unless you have a heavy hand and strip the threads in the drain hole.

Otherwise, follow the mfr's schedule. They designed and built the engine
and know best what's needed to keep it running well.

 

On my '01 Accord I don't change the oil till the indicator says to (usually
around the 7,000 mile mark). I'm now at 256,xxx miles and the engine still
runs smooth. So engine longevity is not an issue. And I've spent half as
much as I would if I followed the '60s thought process and changed every 3k.

 

are you using crappy oil from the 1950's with poor additives and poor
base quality? 'cos if so, stick to the 3k mile regime.

otherwise, honda have gone to a lot of trouble to eliminate guesswork,
superstition and witchcraft from their vehicles, so you can be confident
that the minder will keep your engine safe.

 

While I agree that modern oils can go 5K to 10K miles between oil
changes, how can you suggest that Honda's on-board maintenance minder
is the last word in maintenance when you do not know what algorithm it
uses to calculate oil change frequency?

Experience is not "guesswork, superstition and witchcraft."

 

unless you have numbers, it effectively is the last word. numbers come
from analysis.

"experience" from analysis?

 

Wouldja' think, just maybe, that the second largest car company-- with a
sterling reputaion for quality and reliability-- would somehow manage to
plug in the right numbers when programming the Mileage minder?

So woudja', huh?

 

....make that *Japanese* car company...

-----VP

 

Used oil analyses (UOA) support the computations of maintenance
minders, per

http://www.dtsc.ca.gov/TechnologyDevelopment/OPPTD_FLY_High-Efficiency-Oil-Filters.cfm

http://www.flmowner.com/Storage/CommonImages/images/IOLM%20FAQ.pdf

http://www.ganoa.org/Motor_oil2.htm

UOA has been used for decades in other transportation industries and
is a proven method of maximizing machinery life while minimizing the
expense of oil changes.

(Thanks to others for the first two citations above.)

 

So if Honda is so secure with their algorithm, why do they keep it a
secret?
You think a single algorithm can take into account the entire range of
possible environmental conditions? Or do you think it can account for
"normal" conditions?

Like it or not, Honda is in the business of selling you a car. The
more often you buy one, the more profit they make.

There's tons of oil analysis data available online at bobistheoilguy.

 

You've never owned a business or created anything of value, have you.

 

it's not - that kind of info is all over the web. it's based on oil
temp and number of revolutions.

now what are you going to do with that info?

it's a reasonable approximation. if you want to improve on it, you need
on-board opacity, t.b.n. and spectral analysis, and i don't think anyone
does that on road vehicles yet. heck, hardly anyone measures oil level,
and that's the easy one.

really? why don't you appear to have read any of it?

 

it's not - that kind of info is all over the web. it's based on oil
temp and number of revolutions.[/QUOTE]

and outside temperature, no doubt.

 

don't think so. it's oil temp that matters. outside temp influences
initial, and maybe the high end of summer in vegas, but oil temp is
pretty narrow-band - the rest of the cooling system sees to that.

 

I know Hondas have a water temperature switch but I hadn't heard they
also have an oil temperature sensor or switch.

well first I'm gonna question whether Honda measures oil temp.
which I don't think they do.

then I'm going to suggest that some other factors (like driving on
dirt roads or sustained high RPM operation) ought to be considered.

reasonable approximation? you're guessing. Honda should publish the
algorithm or at least tell us what variables are used. Elmo thinks
this is some sort of valuable trade secret whereas Honda is probably
obscuring an overly simplistic design. It's an idiot light, nothing
more.

enough to know that a wide range of environmental and operating
variables leads to a wide range of engine oil lifespans.

for the average driver, who NEVER checks their oil level between oil
changes, Toyota's 5000 mile interval is probably a safer long-term bet
than Honda's minder. in a Honda, a driver could go a year between
service whereas Toyota's system is likely to bring them in every 6
months.

 

Go ask the Coke folks about their formula for Coke. We'll wait, ...

<g>

I can't think of anyone in private enterprise who makes public anything
he/she doesn't have to. They *are* competing with other concerns, you know.

Finally, how do you know the guy you're criticizing doesn't know Honda's
algorithm? If he does, he's probably signed an NDA and couldn't discuss
it anyway.

Take a pill, relax.

 

they don't - they have a coolant temp sensor. how much different do you
think oil temp and coolant temps are in an all-aluminum engine where
aluminum is an excellent thermal conductor and the oil's picking up its
heat from that aluminum?

what difference does that make??? assuming you're sticking with factory
air filtration of course. if you're not using factory filtration, i
don't see that /any/ manufacturer can [or should] model for conditions
they don't control.

why? what aspect of high rpm's causes whatever it is you're afraid of?

actually, i'm not. a friend of mine is a software engineer that's
worked on these kinds of systems.

why? so they can be second-guessed by a bunch of internet amateurs?
besides, commercial organizations are obligated to protect their
investments.

and this is a perfect example of why there's nothing to be gained by
publishing stuff - some people will never be satisfied.

what "wide range of environmental and operating variables" would these
be then? what are the two conditions that cause the highest rates of
engine wear? what [if anything] do /you/ do to mitigate them?

you can only truthfully speak for yourself there dude - how often do you
check /your/ oil?

with 1950's spec motor oil! but if oil is so crappy, why not 3000 miles
- isn't that safer still? what about 1000?

if we're stuck in your time warp with you, shouldn't we still using
castor oil to lubricate our engines? putting this another way, have you
ever known modern engine oil formulations to actually physically degrade
in 12 months vs 6 months? or are we going to read the owner's manual
and read what the heavily researched and invested manufacturer says on
this subject?

 

Unless you think Toyota doesn't qualify as a "heavily researched and
invested manufacturer" your argument is nonsense.
And if you think a manufacturer's suggested oil change/service
frequency isn't influenced by consumer-organization "total cost of
ownership" calculations, you're naive.

But if you want to suggest to owners that they maintain their cars
according to idiot lights, you go right ahead.

 

why does lexus charge $250 for the same oil change [and same filter!] as
a $70 toyota oil change? could it /possibly/ be anything to do with
revenue generation??? [rhetorical]

well, that's where toyota get their oil change intervals from - it's all
about the $$$'s, nothing to do with actual numbers on oil condition.

you've clearly never bothered with oil analysis - if you had, you'd know
that honda's oil change algorithm is actually pretty conservative.

 

actually, it has to do with the numbnuts you see here who proclaim that
"if you can't afford the service, you can't afford the car!"