R.I.P. General Motors (1931-2006)

....and (as far as I know) the Turkish division of Chrysler is still
selling trucks with the DeSoto nameplate!

http://www.roadkillontheweb.com/images/dt006.jpg

===unidyne===

 

Right, and no one believed 10 years ago that GM would be assembling cars in Mexico and other third world countries either! <g>

 

A very small part of the whole problem. Otherwise Caterpillar, which
is also represented by the UAW, wouldn't be doing so well and wouldn't
be considered the best in its industry.

GM's trouble is 90% bad management. Either they hire Carlos Ghosn from
Renault to save them, or they eventually get taken over by Ford or
Magna, a parts manufacturer.

 

Oh, they will. They can't resist the siren song of yet again
settling in a new land of plenty and promise where they can
be massa on their own plantation.

There are very few "difficulties" companies won't be
prepared to face if tempted by the prospect of not having to
pay their workers.

....

 

Actually, the money would go to a government agency, something like the
Pension Guarenty Trust Board. The trust will take over all the pension
assets and pay the former and present workers a smaller pension than
previously planned. The airlines did this. Now it may be the automakers'
turn.

I don't blame GM's management or the UAW. (Discloser: I am a member of a
strong union: NYC UFT teachers' union).

And it is not the pensions that are the big problem. It is all the health
care costs, both for present workers and retirees.

Jeff

 

The problem is called Wall Street. Pay investors everything including seed,
then there's nothing left.
mark_

 

And the cars are now built with mostly domestic content.

Jeff

 

(...)

You mean like both domestic automakers?

Making products for new overseas markets is good business. The US auto
business is limited. Foreign people want cars. It is the way that a company
grows. You don't see Microsoft say to Europe, you are foreign, we don't want
your business. Boeing doesn't say to China, we don't want to build any
airplanes in Asia: Send your business to Airbus.

What's wrong with US manufacturers expanding by putting plants in other
countries to increase sales?

The other thing is that when they do that, they increase their diversity, so
that when one country is having a bad year, other countries will have good
years. Again, good for US businesses.

Jeff

 

Not just consumer greed. But stock market greed as well.

Jeff

 

Actually, no. Cars will be continue to be made close to where they are sold.
The cost of labor per car keeps going down. Training and quality will
continue to play a big role. When auto companies invest in a new plant, it
will primarily be for production for people in that region, rather than for
people who are in other regions.

 

Politics not be a factor? On what planet do you expect that?

In this case, there is a thick line. And in the US, the environment and
American people would win.

Jeff

 

GM has a huge number of handicaps compared to their competitors, like a huge
number of retirees who depend on them for pensions and health care. Same
with Ford and DiamlerChrysler. The American auto industry has to be
restructured for it to survive. Quite frankly, I don't see the value of
keeping it around if it isn't. The same thing is happening for other
industries, like the airline industry and telecom industry.

Jeff

 

I think unions are still needed. I think unions would do wonders for the
working conditions at Walmart.

That said, union rules and benefits have been a diaster for Ford, GM and DC.

What would you do if you were a GM employee?

And those workers would not want a pension?

Wherever is often domestic. The Toyota Sienna has the highest domestic
content of any US vehicle, excluding big trucks and probably Catapiler
products.

Are we? Hondas and Toyotas get better gas milage and have higher resale
value. Cost is more than what you pay at the dealer.

Apparently the Ford 500, Freestyle and Fusion and pretty good cars. And the
F-150 is the best selling vehicle in the US. My 8.5 yr old Contour is going
strong for ove 125,000 mi (and I think will go strong for many more miles).

I don't like GM cars and trucks too much, but that is more personal
preference.

Jeff

 

They are watching the Northwest airlines bankruptcy and how it goes
down. They will follow in it's footsteps.

 

Who gives a **** about this nationalist corporate bullshit, GFM is a fucking
company thats all it is, big whoop it was big in the UDA, but it was just a
company, another oganization whose sole purpose was to sell shit to fucking
morons and steal hours away from its workers.

Who gives a **** if its fucking Japanesse, yankee or mexican its still the
same fucking story the world over, get the **** over it, fucking morons

 

Dear Jeff,

Having worked as an hourly employee and having had management in the family,
I can tell you what a union would do for Wal-mart: Less than nothing.
Wal-mart would have a gigantic going out of business sale. Sam Walton
would have rather died than go union. And the people running the company
now are of the same mind. But Sam had good wages and benefits back in the
day. He actually RAISED the standard of living for his employees in some of
the small towns he first built stores in.

Also, Unions have been a disaster for the Public Schools. I watched the
standards slide quite a bit in just the 13 years I was in public school. I
have some friends that recently came out of public school and they are
telling me stuff that would scare people. It's becoming increasingly about
indoctrination. And our governor here in Illinois wants to push for 2 years
of pre-school for all, so they can indoctrinate the little kiddies more.
It's not mandatory, yet, but neither was Kindergarten.

Charles of Schaumburg.

 

Caterpillar is beginning its slide

Foreigners are making better machines and Cat is facing the same
downhill future as GM

It is too late to save GM

some parts of it might be usable after the bankruptcy if it comes clean

 

"its
the union thats totally wiping out their profits. unions nowadays do
more
harm than good."

HMMM...Lucky for the greedy corporate types that those Chinese workers
LOVE to work 16 hours a day, in hazardous and dangerous conditions,
fueled by power that spews huge amounts of pollution (There is just so
much hydro) And they LOVE to live in conditions sub par to western
counterparts, FOR JUST PENNIES A DAY!!!

Us DIRTY ROTTEN union members who take a small percentage of the
corporate profit (who the **** was ACTUALLY making the product/profit
anyway??) and by supporting our families and living our lives, ALL THE
FUCKING MONEY GETS PASSED ON, to the rest of the economy. Ever hear how
every dollar earned helps support 10 to 20 other businesses??

If corporations had their way us DIRTY ROTTEN union members would be
working for Chinese wages and only the guys at the top would be getting
the REAL money.

OH, by the way...If you are NOT union and you are NOT the owner of the
company, you can thank your local union members for dragging UP the
wages in your chosen profession, because if they did not pay your sorry
SCAB ass the union scale, YOU would be working for wages like our
Chinese counterparts, PENNIES INSTEAD OF DOLLARS...

NO ONE BUT OWNERS OF A COMPANY HAS ANY RIGHT TO BITCH ABOUT A UNION.

Friggn' scabs need to be boiled in oil...

 

Well for one, I'm not an U.S. citizen. I'm Canadian. Two, I worked briefly
for Toyo, I worked for an equally inferior American company MCI. They have
the same wally world mentality of sending tenders over seas, to reduce their
costs in product manufacturing. Guess what you fucking morons, the price of
a bus is still the same as when they bought parts from the North American
continent. Their product is getting worse in quality, price remains the
same, the workers can't do anything to rectify the quality. Bottom line to
the American owners is putting money in their pockets. I see many companies
doing the same practice, John buhler of ex versatile farm eqiup, actually
helped the Americans rip MCI apart. Where MCI used to be the number 1 bus
company in the world, it will soon be lost cause of the greed of the
American owners.