Timing Belt Tension Problems

RADIAL, sorry.

 

Re the photos at
http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id21.html

My photo-taking bad: The new tensioner actually now
installed on my Honda does have the spring "acting"
tangentially. What I photographed was a "mock-up" using the
old tensioner and old spring, thrown together hastily with
no attention to detail.

I checked several Hondas at the junkyard yesterday. As far
as the spring orientation is concerned, these Hondas'
tensioner installations look like my Honda's.

I can follow this drawing very easily. Thank you. What you
labeled the "pivot point" is where I may have messed up.
While I wondered about that "pivot point" hole opposite
where the spring attaches, I did not figure out that it was
a pivot point.

At this point I have been searching for instructions
specifically on "tensioner installation," because none of my
FS manuals say anything about looking for this peg and
hanging the tensioner on it... It's not like this peg is
easy to notice, given the tightness of this space. Nothing
in the newsgroup archives mentions this, either. I guess it
should have been obvious that the other, larger hole does
have a function.

I think the only question now is whether I should go back in
there, check everything, and follow the steps for tensioning
again, this time paying more attention to the peg etc.
Before starting the car a few days ago, I rotate the
crankshaft about three times and watched the TB. Also, it's
been 150 miles of problem-free driving since then.

Admittedly I can probably get back in there and out again in
a morning at this point.

Or maybe I can just take the upper timing cover off and feel
to see if the spring is in tension? I think I was getting
away with this at the junkyard yesterday.

Thanks again for your help.

 

Re the photos at
http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id21.html

My photo-taking bad: The new tensioner actually now
installed on my Honda does have the spring "acting"
tangentially. What I photographed was a "mock-up" using the
old tensioner and old spring, thrown together hastily with
no attention to detail.

I checked several Hondas at the junkyard yesterday. As far
as the spring orientation is concerned, these Hondas'
tensioner installations look like my Honda's.

I can follow this drawing very easily. Thank you. What you
labeled the "pivot point" is where I may have messed up.
While I wondered about that "pivot point" hole opposite
where the spring attaches, I did not figure out that it was
a pivot point.

At this point I have been searching for instructions
specifically on "tensioner installation," because none of my
FS manuals say anything about looking for this peg and
hanging the tensioner on it... It's not like this peg is
easy to notice, given the tightness of this space. Nothing
in the newsgroup archives mentions this, either. I guess it
should have been obvious that the other, larger hole does
have a function.

I think the only question now is whether I should go back in
there, check everything, and follow the steps for tensioning
again, this time paying more attention to the peg etc.
Before starting the car a few days ago, I rotate the
crankshaft about three times and watched the TB. Also, it's
been 150 miles of problem-free driving since then.

Admittedly I can probably get back in there and out again in
a morning at this point.

Or maybe I can just take the upper timing cover off and feel
to see if the spring is in tension? I think I was getting
away with this at the junkyard yesterday.

Thanks again for your help.

 

you can drive with a very slack belt for some time, but it could skip at
random. a slack belt also gives flutter on the timing/sensor signals.

best to check it's assembled right and re-tension per the book. ensures
another 100k of trouble free mileage and peak performance.

 

you can drive with a very slack belt for some time, but it could skip at
random. a slack belt also gives flutter on the timing/sensor signals.

best to check it's assembled right and re-tension per the book. ensures
another 100k of trouble free mileage and peak performance.

 

This was like one of those movies, where the pilot becomes incapacitated and
the controller has someone take control of the plane and then talks her down
to the runway. Glad things worked out. When I worked on these things in
the 1970s, there was a hole in the cover, where you could loosen the
tensioner clamp bolt, and retension it without removing the cover and other
parts. This hole is still present in my 1999, but you have to be brave to
retension one of these things, without being able to see or feel the belt.

Saludos cordiales,

Earle

 

and yet, it works perfectly if you follow the procedure in the book!

 

$:

Take the upper timing cover off. Put a socket on the crank bolt, and put
all the slack on the tensioner side by applying some counterclockwise
pressure on the socket.

How much slack is there? If there appears not enough slack to make the belt
move much away from the crank timing belt pulley teeth, then you're fine.
Remember that the crank timing belt pulley is very small, and presents the
most danger for a jumped belt. If you can't decide if there's enough slack
to make the belt jump the crank pulley, then you'll need to take enough
apart that you can see the crank timing belt pulley.

Once the tensioner bolt is tightened, the spring ceases to have any
function. If the tension is OK, just leave everything alone.

If you can't decide if the amount of slack you have is OK, leave the upper
timing cover off and drive to a garage. Ask a tech there for his
professional opinion.

 

$:

Take the upper timing cover off. Put a socket on the crank bolt, and put
all the slack on the tensioner side by applying some counterclockwise
pressure on the socket.

How much slack is there? If there appears not enough slack to make the belt
move much away from the crank timing belt pulley teeth, then you're fine.
Remember that the crank timing belt pulley is very small, and presents the
most danger for a jumped belt. If you can't decide if there's enough slack
to make the belt jump the crank pulley, then you'll need to take enough
apart that you can see the crank timing belt pulley.

Once the tensioner bolt is tightened, the spring ceases to have any
function. If the tension is OK, just leave everything alone.

If you can't decide if the amount of slack you have is OK, leave the upper
timing cover off and drive to a garage. Ask a tech there for his
professional opinion.

 

In fact, once the tensioner bolt is tightened, you could even remove the
spring if you wanted to.

 

In fact, once the tensioner bolt is tightened, you could even remove the
spring if you wanted to.

 

I just noticed I have the tensioner spring mislabeled as "tensioner" in
that diagram.

I'll fix that later today.

 

I just noticed I have the tensioner spring mislabeled as "tensioner" in
that diagram.

I'll fix that later today.

 

I appreciate this information. I was unsure of how critical
it was to have the tensioner's larger hole (= the one
opposite where the spring attaches) on the peg. Also, I'd
never had tension on the spring (in this past week of
travails, albeit mostly good learning ones). Not knowing any
better, this morning in 3.5 hours I went in there, got the
tensioner properly "pegged," got the spring properly tensed,
set the tension, rotated the crank a few times and watched
for smooth operation and neither too much slack nor too much
tightness, buttoned her up, checked the timing. All is well.
Thanks so much for sticking with me on this one.

I am getting really fast at changing timing belts.

I am curious: Where did you get the PDF drawing?

 

I appreciate this information. I was unsure of how critical
it was to have the tensioner's larger hole (= the one
opposite where the spring attaches) on the peg. Also, I'd
never had tension on the spring (in this past week of
travails, albeit mostly good learning ones). Not knowing any
better, this morning in 3.5 hours I went in there, got the
tensioner properly "pegged," got the spring properly tensed,
set the tension, rotated the crank a few times and watched
for smooth operation and neither too much slack nor too much
tightness, buttoned her up, checked the timing. All is well.
Thanks so much for sticking with me on this one.

I am getting really fast at changing timing belts.

I am curious: Where did you get the PDF drawing?

 

That's extremely important. The tensioner will not function unless it
can pivot on that peg.

Just glad to help.

I was also kind of curious what the problem was. As I said earlier, it's
easy to assemble the tensioner incorrectly, since it can go together
several different ways.

Experience counts. The first time I removed a Macpherson strut it took
me over an hour. The second time it was 20 minutes. By the third time I
was down to five minutes.

It's just a (bad) scan from my '91 Integra's shop manual. I then added
the text in a graphics program.

I had the scan resolution set very low without noticing it, which is why
it's so bad. I corrected the wrong text, but otherwise will leave this
one alone.

 

That's extremely important. The tensioner will not function unless it
can pivot on that peg.

Just glad to help.

I was also kind of curious what the problem was. As I said earlier, it's
easy to assemble the tensioner incorrectly, since it can go together
several different ways.

Experience counts. The first time I removed a Macpherson strut it took
me over an hour. The second time it was 20 minutes. By the third time I
was down to five minutes.

It's just a (bad) scan from my '91 Integra's shop manual. I then added
the text in a graphics program.

I had the scan resolution set very low without noticing it, which is why
it's so bad. I corrected the wrong text, but otherwise will leave this
one alone.

 

By any chance do you mean the tensioner's //spring// will
not function unless the tensioner housing can pivot on the
peg? And if this is so, then given that you observed that,
"Once the tensioner bolt is tightened, the spring ceases to
have any function... you could even remove the spring if you
wanted... ," then the peg also only has a function during
this tension adjusting step, so it too could be removed?

I think it's very helpful. My web site on this is garbage at
the moment. I will either take it down or re-do it. If I
re-do it, and if you do not mind, I may put the PDF file on
it. Okay?

I do not see this drawing at the UK site's "factory service"
manuals. Do you know whether the UK sites's manuals are
abbreviated ones? Plus there is no "tensioner replacement"
section; only an "adjusting TB tension" one. Does your Acura
shop manual have a "tensioner replacement" section?

 

By any chance do you mean the tensioner's //spring// will
not function unless the tensioner housing can pivot on the
peg? And if this is so, then given that you observed that,
"Once the tensioner bolt is tightened, the spring ceases to
have any function... you could even remove the spring if you
wanted... ," then the peg also only has a function during
this tension adjusting step, so it too could be removed?

I think it's very helpful. My web site on this is garbage at
the moment. I will either take it down or re-do it. If I
re-do it, and if you do not mind, I may put the PDF file on
it. Okay?

I do not see this drawing at the UK site's "factory service"
manuals. Do you know whether the UK sites's manuals are
abbreviated ones? Plus there is no "tensioner replacement"
section; only an "adjusting TB tension" one. Does your Acura
shop manual have a "tensioner replacement" section?

 

correct pivot action is essential to correct setup.

you should set the tension with the covers on, so you shouldn't be able
to remove anything.