where is the coolant going?

I have a 2001 Honda Civic LX, 115k miles, that I
bought used about 2 years ago. It needed a head
gasket (caught and fixed by the dealer under warranty
fortunately).

Over the summer, it started using coolant, about 8 ounces
per week. There is no evidence it is going into the oil,
and no drips reach the ground. I drive about 300-400 miles
per week with it.

It doesn't seem to be drawing back properly from the overflow
reservoir, which I have taken to keep overfilled because the
clear plastic has gone translucent and I 9 times out of ten
can't see where its coolant level is. Although it apparently
does draw some back eventually because the overflow does go
down too. Keeping it full doesn't prevent adding the 8 ounces
per week directly to the radiator. A mechanic verified the hose
was not plugged (apparently by blowing through it).

The mechanic couldn't find a leak. He used a pressurized tester,
and it didn't lose pressure. But he did say that because I was
overfilling the overflow reservoir, there was some spillage that
may have masked a small leak.

[I'm thinking of making some sort of an overflow reservoir dipstick,
anyone have any suggestions for that?]

A perhaps unrelated observation (that I did tell the mechanic)
is that sometimes a belt squeals, usually at startup, for a
few minutes, or even more. It also seems to squeal after I
get it wet riding through puddles, so I'm wondering if maybe
the water pump is leaking slowly enough, only during operation,
that it never drips on the ground, but gets the belt slippery
wet? (you just can't crawl under these low slung cars like the
old days to have a look).

It isn't the end of the world, but it is annoying to have to keep
adding coolant every week.

Can anyone offer advice on where it might be going and what it would
take to fix it?

One more observation. The heater sometimes goes through cycles where
it doesn't deliver very hot air when the controls are maxed out.
Possibly an air bubble due to the slow leak, but it seems not to be
100% correlated. It seems to me that the computer may be inhibiting
the amount of heat delivered. Does the computer do that on this model?
At first I was afraid that I would sometimes not have enough heat when
it got very cold out, but it never delivers not enough heat. It just
seems to decide sometimes how much I get. Since it doesn't seem to be
correlated to low coolant, I concluded it must be the computer
tinkering with the temperature. (at least something that kicks in or
changes over stops and starts and high speed to low speed and back).

Thanks!

 

Is the radiator cap the 'Right" type??


Pannawonica ..

 

It is the one that was in the (used) car when I
got it. I can investigate, but what different
types are there? And the wrong type could cause
these symptoms?

Thanks.

 

There are basically 2 different types of radiator caps
one type that allows flow in both directions used with an
overflow tank and the other that doesn't will just all flow in one
direction that out..
then is the radiator cap of the correct pressure..


Pannawonica ..

 

how'd you go??

 

I bought a radiator cap from a dealer several weeks ago.
They needed the first digit of the VIN to determine which
was required. They said it matters if the car was manufactured
in Japan, US, or Canada. So I got the right one.

But the coolant still is going down.

I've been googling and reading more. It seems aluminum engines
(which I have) are bad with gaskets and seals with any
overheating. When I got the car used they had to put in a
head gasket (they paid for that, but I discovered it during
30 day warranty).

From reading, the possibilities seem to be:

water pump - is under the timing belt cover and leakage may
not reach the ground

radiator - slight leakage may not hit the ground

head gasket - again!!?? (aluminum engine a lemon?)

cracked cylinder bore or cylinder head (one person found this
and replaced (one head leaking into its cylinder) from junkyard
and it fixed it)

and general googling for any make/model:

intake manifold gasket (not sure if this applies to 2001 Honda Civic)

One person on a GM car says to try cooling system tablets from
Pep Boys (Barsleak blister pack of 5).

Another says to have a trusted mechanic run:
1. collant pressure test (I did and he reported it kept pressure, but
a very slow leak may not have been detected)
2. if no leak check cylinders for coolant
3. if no coolant found then compression test on every cylinder (to find
one with low compression = head gasket).
4. be careful of being ripped off.

Meanwhile, I've just been adding a few ounces every few days. I
may just continue doing this unless it gets worse.

 

--
Pannawonica ..

You might try and re-tension the head bolts VERY CAREFULLY..

Barsleak is a desperate measure and when you have to..
however its much better to Fix the problem
than hope it will go away..

I don't have a Honda I drive a Landcruiser..
is there a welsh/core plug on the head and out of sight
under the inlet manifold??
Had a problem once on a GM engine the core plug
was hidden and leaking straight into the cylinders and out the tail pipe..

Pannawonica ..

 

John, you can try to check the spark plug of each cylinder to see any
sign of deterioration.

Your cylinder head may have been warped from the overheating, causing
the new gasket to not seal properly. Check with the mechanic.
Sometimes re-torque all the head bolts to correct specs would help but
since your problem has been going on for a while, you may need a new
head.

 

In the good old days (and I mean old) you would cure this by having the head
skimmed at an engineering shop. It was much cheaper than a new head. Can
that still be done with modern engines?

 

I don't know, maybe someone will post that knows.

I'm still in the just keep adding coolant stage. It is quite cheap
actually. About a gallon over the last year, but I now have
suspicion it may be accelerating.

And, this week, the check engine light came on for 2 days, went out for
2 days, came on for 2 days, went out for 2 days, and is now on for
one day. With 120k miles it might be the catalytic converter, or...
The dealers, in my experience, charge about $100 to tell you what
code is being set. But I have heard some shops (muffler type shops?
Pep Boys?) will tell you for free or almost nothing now (seems to me
there was a court ruling requiring manufacturers to open up access to
the codes).

Any idea if I can find out what the code means cheaply?

Thanks!

 

No, I'm afraid not. I am in England and the guy who does my servicing is
always happy to read a code for you without charge. When you get it read
it may give a guide as to where the coolant is going. Good luck.

 

GooGle Is Your Friend..

http://www.engine-light-help.com/honda-check-engine-light.html


Pannawonica ..

 

And I'm in Australia..

Pannawonica ..

 

That is a useful site, thanks. However I think he meant read and explained
rather than just explained.

 

Thanks! A great resource. But I don't have the equipment to
get the code. All I have is the light. Is there a $10 Radio
Shack gizmo that you connect somewhere to get the code?

 

An update. Over the course of the first half of this year, the
coolant usage has gone up to a pint to a quart per day!

I got desperate and had a mechanic put KW Block Seal in it.
This required a flush first, run for 30 minutes or so with
water only, dry overnight, flush again next day, put antifreeze
in again.

It has slowed down the usage, maybe even close to have fixed it.
I'm not ready to conclude that yet because I have had to overfill
the overflow tank because it is now so translucent it is almost
opaque and I can't see the level, even with a flashlight. Today
I devised a fish tank tube and cork stopper where I can lower it
into the overflow, cork it, put it out and see where the level is.

Anyway, with at lease partial success, I have also now found out
about K-Seal which can be added to the antifreeze mixture itself.
If the level does go down, I'll use that too.

Not to worry about the car, I'm very near getting rid of it anyway.
It now also needs an A/C clutch and probably compressor. ($150 used
from a salvage place, i.e. junkyard).

However, I now have another issue... see my next post.

 

An update. (I've now moved to Google Groups). The KW Block Seal
did not completely seal things. And two weeks after using it, the
engine began overheating to the point the instrument panel was
cutting out, and the battery indicator would come on. The car can
only be run (by jumping) for short periods of time. It needs a new
engine. I now have a used 2007 Toyota Corolla. damagedcars.com
has offered me $1050 for the Honda carcass. I don't know if KW
Block Seal accelerated the demise, but I suspect so. I think it may
have frozen up something that shouldn't have.

The positive result is that I have now replaced the car, which I
should have done sooner.

 

<snip>

On this side of the pond we had something called Radweld (might still exist
for all I know). It was supposed to seek out leaks in the radiator and
seal them. Trouble was that small waterways looked exactly like leaks and
it sealed them as well, turning the engine into quite an efficient kettle on
occasions. One engine I looked at had the entire bottom hose connection
plugged with it.