Why cant Toyota or Honda make a car that drives just like a BMW?

No; *you* do. The very *last* car badged 'Chevrolet Nova' was a
rebadged 4- and 5-door Toyota Corolla (lagging by one model year when
the cycle changed) and built in California in the Toyota-GM joint
venture NUMMI plant. Same place as where my old FX-16 (and other
Corolla FXs) was built. They also did, for one or two years, a
hotted-up version that was, originally at least, painted black with a
red beltline stripe all the way around the car and the same 4A-GE 16V
engine and drivetrain as the FX-16 and the MR-2. Don't go showing
your ignorance.

 

Let's see...

you work for 8 hours, but they don't count lunch as work, so
it's really 35 hours they pay you for. Which means you are
THERE full-time, but get paid as a part-time employee.

No benefits, to health care, nothing.


Or, they use the new laws pushed through by Bush to count
you as a salaried "management" employee and work you for 60+
hours a week and only pay you for 40. No overtime.

That's the harsh reality. Employers will screw with you as an
employee if it saves them $5 a day.

 

I fear you are giving the British motor industry too much credit. I am sure
it would have collapsed without the Japanese, too...

What is left of the old British-owned 'volume' manufacturers is called Rover
and that should have been put out of its misery years ago. Those poor
sentimental folk at BMW didn't see that.

DAS
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NB: To reply directly replace "nospam" with "schmetterling"
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The entire British motor industry almost died forever

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Just say no to drugs.

 

Sorry, without hard facts, it's still just your opinion.

Yet, my 2000 Odyssey needed a new transmission less than a month after I
bought it, and I've received 2 recall notices so far on my CRV. Hondas
aren't infallible. I had plenty of problems with the various ones I owned (6
and counting). My 78 and 79 Accords rusted before my eyes. My friend's 86
Accord was better, but pretty shot by '97. He bought a 98 323i and shows no
sign of getting rid of it anytime soon. I don't think you'd want to ask him
which company he thinks makes a better car. My wife's '89 Accord needed a
water pump, a radiator, and a new distributor cap right after the warranty.
The cap cost $100 plus labor. Etc., etc. Different cars, different
experiences. Still, I think Honda makes a darn good car with perhaps the
best value for money in the industry.

That's not what I said. It isn't a question of defining yourself. It's a
question of whether you consider driving a pleasure or a chore. I like to
drive, and it's much harder for me to get pleasure out of driving a
refrigerator. I can appreciate that my BMW is a beautifully balanced fun to
drive machine, just as much as I can appreciate the utility of my CRV. But
there's absolutely no question about which one is a better vehicle for the
sheer pleasure of driving. BTW, I kept my last BMW (87 325is) for 13 years
and then gave it to my nephew who drives it every day.

But the end result is just what I said. All cars-for whatever reason, be it
competition or technology-are getting better and better.

 

.. My friend's 86

Go have a look at a '86 3 series. Plenty of rust.

At least compare cars of equal *decades*, FFS.

 

I don't know about that. It's not like the Brits had any real
competition in their default niche, which was sporty, good handling,
autos and motorcycles. US stuff was essentially huge tuna boats
lumbering around on $.27/gal gas and sporty Italian thingies barely
able to make it from one non-existent repair shop to another. When
the first Jap stuff hit our shores, Brit motor vehicles were selling
like hotcakes (at least here in CA) and had no real competition. The
first thing we did when we got out of high school (or the service) was
sell off our 3rd and 4th hand American clunkers and moved up to hot
Brit motorcycles or Brit roadsters.

But, the writing was on the wall. The bikes were the first to fall.
How could they compete with Jap bikes that were just as fast at 1/3
the price? Sure, the Brit bikes were handling thoroughbreds compared
to the early Nippon slugs, but the price differential was too much.
No one could compete with Japan's dumping practices. And, as time
passed, Japanese machinery got better and better. In time they were
as good as Brit bikes and still cost less. The Brits lost their
shorts. And a decade later, the Brit auto industry suffered the same
fate.

Sure, most of the problem was the Brits hadn't updated a single plant
or design in decades, and so were caught napping in the Japanese
design/marketing revolution. And when they finally realized the depth
of the problem, the powerful labor unions kept them from quickly
adapting to a rapidly changing market. But, I still maintain that if
the Japanese hadn't launched an economic attack on the comatose world
transportation industry, the Brits would have continued for
considerably longer than they did.

nb

 

i finally sold my 1989 camry, with 280,000 miles on it. the only problem
with it was the rear fenders rusting out.

 

Ooh my. Looks just like this one.

The daily news is rife with

Move to Cuba. The government guarantees you a job, food and medical
care. Trading freedom for security sure was a great bargain. Sorry,
the Soviet Union is no longer an option. Americans are such scaredy
cat security loving snots. Everything has to be guaranteed and
insured. The only guarantee you have in life is to starve and be too
hot or too cold. Life's a bitch, so you should have a little
compassion for your fellow man. If you want better than that you have
to get off your butt and work for it. You may lose. That's the way
it goes.

That would be to their benefit, wouldn't it?

Apparently these illegal aliens have no trouble doing the jobs.

Again, that would be in their benefit, wouldn't it? Human beings are
tragically flawed and always look out for their own self interest.
Even if they are in government or labor unions.

True, see, we agree on lot's of stuff like your keen analysis of
politicians.

YOUR statement

I didn't say they wouldn't. I specifically mentioned their greed.
When you needed a roof put on, did your hire a 62 year old who can't
climb a ladder, get him full medical insurance and promise him
lifetime employment and retirement benefits? I'm sure you did, not
being a low life hypocrite and all.

The industrial age is over. Industrial age people will die off and
new people will take their place. Maybe they will be information
workers, but I am sure it will be more complicated than that.
Industrial workers kicked the crap out of agricultural workers (did
you just work sun up to sun down hand hoeing a wheat field?).
Agricultural workers kicked the crap out of hunter gatherers.
Automation means we really don't need everyone to be employed. We can
hand out 39 weeks unemployment to anyone and there is no lack of goods
and services. Society is gonna have to adjust. You can spend you
life being hostile and unhappy because the world doesn't match your
expectations or you can deal with reality and be happy. I hope you
choose happy.

We now have the leisure time to do the only important thing in life:
Sliding tires on dry pavement in a Honda
Cheers,
Roadie Roger

 

Clearly that was due to American Managers in bed with your local
government conspiring to salt the roads you drive on...

 

More like a mistake at birth...

 

Where do you think "hard facts" come from? Some website?

--

~~Philip

"Never let school interfere
with your education - Mark Twain"

 

Nope.

What about paying taxes and going to the loo?

DAS
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NB: To reply directly replace "nospam" with "schmetterling"
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It seems the British auto industry had already collapsed by the time you
focussed on it, if you think there was a default niche. Like I said, Rover
is the remnant of the volume business. Decades ago the level of imports was
very small. There was a niche only in the sense that very few cars found a
ready market abroad, a few sales of MGBs and Jags in Europe and California
notwithstanding. There were many manufacturers, most of whom were forced to
merge into British Leyland by the government in an effort to stop them going
under. Now there are niche manufacturers such as Caterham, Bristol, Morgan
and the like.

The Mazda MX-5 (Miata) is what the British sports car should have been.
Fun, relatively inexpensive and RELIABLE.

DAS

 

Well, some websites do have statistics on reliability-JD Power for one, and
CR for another. I can't see how one person's biased experience can be
universally applied to all Honda models from all years in all parts of the
country. My experience with Hondas is mixed, yet I don't conclude anything
about Hondas in total from this, because my data is insufficient to do so.

 

I thought so. Hard Facts® come from empirical experience. Vehicles
actually have to be run into concrete barriers, other vehicles, at
different angles, spun around on a skid pad .... to get real life
data because computer models do miss mitigating factors, especially
where operator input occurs. The people who do the "mop up" repairs
are the ones who know what's worth knowing.
--

~~Philip

"Never let school interfere
with your education - Mark Twain"

 

(Phil) hat in Betrag @news.easynews.com dies gedichtet:

The hardest time for BMW were the years after WWII. They had a capacity
problem and a model range problem.

The capacity problem was the fact, that their valuable production
facilities in Eisenach were seized by the soviet troops and went lost for
BMW. In the first years of the GDR there were Eisenach made BMW cars
available in the soviet zone. BMW solved the capacity problem later by
buying the car manufacturer Glas in Dingolfing. Today mainly the 5-Series
is made in Dingolfing.

The second problem of BMW was the odd model lineup in the early 50s. They
only had extremely expensive super cars like 501/502, 503, 507 or the
tiny Isetta, which was hardly a car. Nothing to compete with the medium
class cars made by Borgward, VW, DKW, Ford or Opel. The BMW 700 with rear
mounted engine was beautiful, but too expensive. Things began to become
better when they started the BMW 1500, a fast, yet roomy sedan with good
performance and a reasonable price. The 02 model was a similar concept,
only with two doors. It became a huge success.

Frank

 

Could it be said that a person with diarrhea is a "Loo-zer?"

 

http://catalog.eautopartscatalog.com/buymb/wizard.jsp?partner=buymb&clientid=buyeuroparts&baseurl=http://www.buyeuroparts.com/&cookieid=0TT0PMLOP&year=1991&make=BM&model=525-I-002&category=N&part=Brake+Pad+Set

Bimmerworld will *not* be getting my business any more!

Floyd

 

To me, they came very close to the way the 3 series drives with the IS.
I drove both 3's and IS's before buying my IS, and the handling seemed
about equal. The 325 is a little slower and the 330 is a little faster
than the IS300 camparing auto/auto or manual/manual. Both the BMW and
IS engines are very smooth and nice sounding. The IS seems to have a
little more road and/or wind noise than the BMW, though.

I bought my SportCross mainly because it should be more reliable than a
BMW, and it has been totally trouble-free so far (~20 miles). Also, I
found a very low mileage, mint condition used one and saved quite a bit
of money over buying a Bimmer or IS new.

The thing I wish Toyota had copied more closely from BMW when designing
the IS is the instruments. They IS instruments are a little too gimicky
for my tastes. Still, I like the car a lot.