Why I spurn American Cars

Do people find the following features as annoying as I do?

1) The rattles and shakes. Even little bump I encounter, I get these
funky sounds from all over the car. It is so damn annoying. Can any
claim that their American car does not rattle or doesn't have
torsional shakes when encountering potholes? Obviously almost every
car has some sort of rattle and shakes but bad as American Cars?

2) Cheeziest interiors. American Cars have the worst design interior
of any brands. Everything from choice of materials to design of
gauges. Ergonomics are a nightmare. (Only notible exception is the
Aurora)

3) Poor fit & finish. My mother once looked at a new LH and I sat in
the back and examine the roof. Poof! Off comes the paneling. I
initially thought it must be just this car, got into another LH and
same problem. The worst fit and finish problem with American cars is
the wind and road noise. Can the American Manufacturer's produce a
car that has proper sealing doors and windows?

4) Americans cars are the uglist cars on the planet today (except the
cars produced in the former Eastern Bloc countries). Everything from
panel spacing to design. Roadmaster, Caprice Classic, Lumina,
Cadillacs, to name a few of the uglies. There was a time when
American Cars set the standard for styling, but that time has passed
along with Disco and Bell-bottoms.

5) Driver feedback. Yucky Steering and Brake feel. There is about a
1 inch dead zone on my Jeep Cherokee where the steering wheel moves
but the car does not. It is difficult to know when brakes will lock up
give the spongy feel of American brakes. Also very difficult to know
when you rear-end will slide out since the only feedback from your
butt and back is the vibration from the lousy chassis.

6) Lack of driver reward. I have never recalled feeling giddy coming
up to a winding road when driving an American car. Driving one of
these things is completely devoid of pleasure and reward.

I currently own only one American car, a 1994 Pontiac Grand AM. I
have own a couple other American cars. I have had experience with
Corvettes Camaros, Fieros, Cutlasses, GMC trucks / Vans, Dodge products
etc. I own two European cars both of which are free of the things I
described above.

I am willing to buy another American car if they can produce something
worth buying. I will wait...hopefully for a short time.

I am interested in people's views on American cars and whether they
see them in a bad light as I do. I do not intend to start a flame
war, I am truly interested. It is my opinion that once a person buys
a Jap or European car, they tend not to go back to American cars. IF
this is true, how will American Cars attract this market back?

I look forward to see if anyone shares my opinions.

 

What a Moron!
Your arguments are so subject to personal opinion that I can't believe that
you would even post them a public forum!
I'm sure that lot's of people share your opinions, but just as many (myself
included) would disagree.
Anyone can point out case by case examples of poor quality in ANY brand of
car. My friend had the front rack and pinion assembly fall off his brand new
Nissan 2 days after he bought it. Another friend has a 2 year old Camry
which has gone through 3 sun roof motors and the roof leaks like a sieve. I
also have friends that have had problems with new American cars. But to
question things like design, road noise, etc. without actual data is
pointless.
If it were the late 1970's or early 1980's I would agree with you. But in
the 80's the foreign car makers completely kicked the American carmakers
butts and woke them up and they have been making dramatic improvements ever
since. Other than the lingering sentiments of people like yourself I think
that the issues of quality, fit , and design that existed between American
and foreign carmakers are gone. Of course a $50,000 Lexus SHOULD be a better
vehicle than an Impala. But if you look at the new generation Cadillacs
versus the Lexus or Mercedes equals you will be amazed at how many
comparisons the Caddy will win!
It's kind of like fighting over religion or whether Aerosmith's music is
better than the Rolling Stones!

 

Nice troll! Oh, and superlative cross-posting, too!

 

No. If you had the choice of a reliable, competitively priced US derived car
against expensive, designed for autobahn-fallapartcars or worse, British
unreliable, analy retentive engineered rubbish, then you'd take the US model
everytime.

Jason

 

Face it, Japanese and European cars are far, far superior to MOST (not
all) American cars.

Here's my personal opinion: I do like some of the new Cadillac CTS, but
other than that, I can't name a single American car that I genuinly
like. I can tell you dozens of Japanese and European cars that I like.

But since subjective opinions do not matter much, look at the
reliability problems, cheap and badly designed interiors, poor
performance engines (I mean hp/l NOT total hp) in American cars. You
only have to open the Consumer Reports Guide and other (mostly)
non-biased publications. You'll see the numbers there, don't take my
word for it.

An example I found very amusing is the price comparison between a 2000
Accord EX and a Crown Victoria. Today, in 2003 they both cost the same,
about CAD$20k. But in 2000, the Accord was CAD$24K and the Crown
Victoria was more than CAD$40k.

If you can't accept that, that's ok, the Big Three need to sell their
cars to somebody, might as well be you. So before you call others names,
get your facts straight.

Cosmin

 

I have worked on the process- quality side of steel production. When the
heat (a ladle of steel) is bound for Toyota or Honda- there are stricter
practices enforced. The rejection criteria are much broader for US
automakers than transplants.
There is no doubt whatsoever that US car producers are more careless and
sleepy compared to the "foreign" companies.

 

Anbody who drives a car is biased you jack ass. You can not get a
subjective totally unbiased opinion from anybody with a drivers license and
a car title in there hands. You can not compare an Accord and a Crown Vic,
they are two totally different cars in two totally different groups.
Compare an Accord with lets say a Taurus you are closer in size. All
comparisons would have to be per capita as they sell differently. But these
two cars would be a more equal match as they sell closer in figures than a
Crown Vic does to an Accord or Taurus. Then compare there price
differences, that new Taurus is much lower priced than the over priced
Accord. With nearly the same options and size.

 

Uh....I'm sure hp/l is important...somehow....to drivers in traffic.
Please explain.

Uh...I'm sure past price comparisons of older year models are important to
buyers of new models ....somehow.
Please explain.

thanks

 

Pleae explain how it affects the end user.

Thanks.

 

It does matter in terms of the technology invested into the engine. Any
company can make big engines with a lot of horsepower. But to make a
small, fairly economic and at the same time performant engine takes a
lot of R&D. American cars are just not at the same level as the Japanese
or Europeans in this respect, with the exception of very few of their
models. Maybe in a few years that's going to change, but they're
definitely not there yet.

As to "drivers in traffic", well, I ride a motorcycle to work, so that
doesn't really apply to me.

How many years do you plan on keeping your car? If I buy an Accord
today, and I sell it 3 years from now I'll take a loss of about CAD$5k.
If I buy a Crown Vic, I'll take a loss of CAD$20k. How is that not
important again? And the Accord/Crown Vic was just an example, it holds
true for most other comparisons.

But like I said in my previous post, you're MORE than wellcome to buy
American cars. Somebody has to buy them. I'll just stick to my Honda for
now, maybe I'll go for an Integra or a Cellica next time.

Cosmin

 

I thought you only had a problem understanding the points in mt post,
but I see you can't draw very, very simple conclusions. Sad...

Cosmin

 

Why I spurn Import Cars....

The parts are very expensive, mostly unavailable unless you go to a
dealership and pay big bucks. Most do not have on board diagnostics
until 1996 when the USA forced the import manufacturers to comply. (I
forgot - you have to look at the blinking lights under the passenger
side carpet on a pre 1996 Honda) There is no room to work behind the
dash unless you have hands the size of a 6 year old... Most electrical
systems have problems.... especially the KIA vehicles. They are
overpriced, and uncomfortable... compare riding in an Accord and then
ride in a Crown Vic or a Taurus.... the difference from sitting on a
rock seat and a nice comfortable ride... The Accord is the highest
theft vehicle in the US - because the kids like to trick them out - so
if you get one - most likely it will be stolen - But that is my
opinion! I am ready to get FLONKED by all you import loving people
now.........BUY AMERICAN - BE AMERICAN -

 

My car has two rattles... One somewhere in teh front when hitting potholes
and such, and my drivers side door panel is a little loose and will make a
squeaky rattle sometimes when sitting at stop light. If I ever get off my
ass I'll tighten up the screws on that door panel adn that will be cured.
Not sure what's causing the rattle in the front, but again, if I ever get in
the moood to find it (not likley in this 90*-100* weather!) I'll fix it. Not
bad for a 35 year old car.

My mom has a '97 Caravan which has no rattles or shakes.

I find both my my cars ('67 and '68 Galaxie 500) interior styling to be
quite good looking. All new cars look pretty much the same and most suffer
from a complete lack of leg room (for tall people like me anyway) and
sometimes lack of headroom. It's always that same gray cloth interior or
greay leather. Rarely any color inside most new cars.

I wouldn't know what an LH is, but I doubt things like that are common. I
know I've enver seen them in my grandparents cars, and they usually lease so
have new cars fairly often. They've had plenty of Chevy's and Fords (don't
remember any Mopar though).

My mom's Caravan has very little road noise, in fact, my dad's Geo and
girlfriends father's Camy both have louder road noise. As for my Galaxies, I
always have the windows down except in winter. Don't remember too well any
road noise, but that hole in the exhaust right before the muffler on my '68
makes for some resonating at certain RPM.

99% of new cars are hideous. Don't give me that crap about American cars
being the ugliest... All cars look the same anymore. There was a time when
you could look at a car and instantly know the make, model, and trim
package. Nowadays you're lucky enough to guess the make.

I loathe power brakes. They totally deaden the road feel. I'd prefer to have
manual steering, but I don't believe that was common on late '60s full-size
Fords. As for knowing when your brakes will lock, that's simply a matter
of knowing your car. It's entirely your fault that you don't know your own
car. Same thing with the rear sliding out, though nearly all cars are FWD
anymore so that isn't a common thing.

I think it's fun to drive my Galaxies down winding roads... Kinda like
driving a boat. But seriously, it's a blast to cruise around in my cars.
I go for pleasure drives all the time. At least once a week I'll go out with
no destination in mind and just burn gas.

Good for you. Stick to the cars you like, I'll stick to the cars I like.
Though admittedly foreign cars (not necessarily European) are great for one
thing, and that's mileage. Nothing like getting 31+ MPG on the highway,
without an overdrive transmission no less!

There are very few new American cars I'd be interested in buying.
Mustang Mach 1
'88 Monte Carlo SS

Those are the only two I can think of off the top of my head. Anything else
is pointless, as I may as well just go with a Japanesse econo-box and leave
my real cars for enjoyment.

I see most new cars in the same "light" you see American cars. Poor quality,
overpriced, underpowered, don't last, etc... Typically it's the econo-boxes
that last. Nothing new is going to be good looking, so you may as well go
for mileage and look to the past for a toy.

Oh, and what the hell does alt.space.monkey.invaders have to do with cars?
LOL Silly troll. *pokes troll with stick*

 

Face it, Japanese and European cars are far, far superior to MOST (not

While your post seems to have a complete absence of facts, I'll bite
anyway.

American and import means less and less these days.

More "American" cars host engines/platforms/parts from import makers,
and more and more "imports" are made in America.

BMW owns Land Rover, which has the worst car made in years. The Land
Rover Discovery Series II has the worst service record of any car made
(off of 2001 records). They were so bad, the President of BMW even
admitted to their horrible flaws.

Many companies have been going on buying binges, not only to add to
their product line, but to strengthen it with parts/plants of other
companies.


Plus, that Crown Vic you're talking about...

It is one of the top cars to buy used - because of it's reliability.
They are used as cabs in New York, and police cruisers across the U.S.
Why? Because they are basically bullet-proof.


The simple truth is if you research cars - INDIVIDUAL CARS - you're
going to find good American and good import cars. You are also going
to find bad cars (less reliable - there aren't many really bad cars
anymore).

I happen to have both American and Imports right now.

I have had good service out of all my cars, with proper maintenance
and care. At this time I own an SUV (Isuzu Trooper), a Sedan (Pontiac
Bonneville SSEi), and a Sports car (Nissan 300ZX).

I bought all three used because I don't care to have that big loss the
moment I drive off a lot. They all had less than 20,000 miles when I
bought them.

I bought the Trooper because they are bullet proof. And I liked the
utility/size/drive of the vehicle. I looked at several SUV's from
Mitsubishi, Nissan, Land Rover, GM, and Ford. I chose what I felt was
the best vehicle for the money.

I bought the Bonnie because the engine 3800 Series 2 was ranked one of
the five best engines in the world. It's push rod design, while not
cutting edge, is an incredibly reliable, and hardy piece of mechanics,
plus I got all the bells and whistles for a fraction of a poorly
equipped Honda or Toyota. The Honda or Toyota - base models were
about 4-5 K more, the BMW's I checked out were even higher. The BMW's
had another disadvantage for my driving, they were RWD. I live in the
mountains, and prefer my FWD for daily driving.

I bought the Nissan, because, well because it's fun. That and because
there are few engines better than the 3.0 Nissan. Tried and true in
their most visible platforms. Maxima/trucks/300ZX. The car is very
fast with it's twin turbo.

 

Japanese and European cars are not superior to American Cars. Most
vehicles manufacturered after 1995 are equal. The point is that most
european and japanese cars are designed so you can't purchase the parts
for them, and the manufacturers have made it extremely difficult to work
on them. Us Americans - like to work on our cars and do our own
repairs, and find our parts at the local parts store, and not pay a
fortune for the parts. That is the problem with those foreign jobs...
The point I am making is that the people that are buying these cars are
ripping off the American economy and themselves. The bottom line is you
get what you pay for. Compare an American Manufactured Truck to an
import truck.... Can't compare can you. Put two rocks in the back of an
import truck and it is resting on the springs. Tow something with an
import truck, and it can't make the grade without turning 9,000 RPM to
go 30 MPH. Show me a great import truck with a diesel engine - Where
is the superiority there? Interesting..... I do love getting FLONKED though!

 

I have owned many vehicles over the years. Honda Accords, Toyota
Trucks, Chevy Blazers, Pontiac Grand Prix, Dodge Intrepid, Ford Taurus,
Ford Truck F250, Ford Torino, Plymouth Roadrunner, Dodge Charger,
Plymouth Fury, Mazda RX3, Pontiac Bonneville, Chevy Corsica, Datsun
(Nissan) B210, Nissan 200SX, Ford Bronco II, 53 Pontiac - so you can
say I have had a little experience with cars. I have never owned a BMW
or Mercedes so I can't say much about those cars.... However I have
found all of those vehicles reliable in a fashion. I love the american
muscle car. There is nothing that can replace the feel of genuine
horsepower. The upscale American vehicles were quiet and trouble free.
As a matter of fact all of the vehicles I mentioned above were pretty
much trouble free. The import vehicles I owned lacked power and the
interiors were crampy - however the fuel economy was good. The issue on
import vehicles were expensive and hard to find replacement parts and
little room to work under the hood. The American cars had cheap and
easy to find replacement parts and were generally easier to work on.
They were more comfortable to drive - with less fuel economy of course,
but overall they have been much easier to maintain.

I have a unique perspective that most of you on do not. I have been in
the Auto Parts Aftermarket for 26 years. Yes, I stood behind the
counter for many of those years selling parts. I can tell you what
breaks and what does not. Every vehicle out there has it's weak point,
foreign or domestic. I rarely sell a part for a Mercedes or BMW or
Porsche for that matter, because the owners can't work on them - they
are forced to drag it to the repair garage. Most Toyota's are pretty
solid - Nissans have lots of electrical problems, Honda's have
transmission problems, Hyundai has engine problems, KIA's have huge
electrical problems, Dodges have front end and brake problems, GM's have
transmission problems, Fords have transmission problems etc... For each
vehicle out there I can tell you what seems to be the weak point -
Every manufacturer without question has their own individual unique
problems.

The general gripe on the imports are they are difficult to work on, the
later models are difficult to tune and there is no room to work under
the hood. Most domestic vehicles are easier to work on except those
that are cross overs.... meaning Ford Ranger / Mazda Truck.... same
vehicle - same running gear etc...

It really comes down to you. Do you like a roomy interior, a quiet
ride, Performance, Easy to work on, etc. Those choices will decide what
vehicle you want to buy and own.

I support the USA. I admit, I have tried some of those import vehicles
and learned my lessons too. There is nothing easier to work on and find
parts for than good old US vehicles...

 

just got rid of a ford......it made lots of wind/road noise.........99
Taurus........wouldn't ever give up my Gprix Gtp for a Ford or anything else
for that matter....one of the most quiet cars that there is in my opinion

 

I Grand Prix I have is quiet - I have a 99 Taurus, 02 Ford Truck... no
wind noise in those...Must have been a seal problem somewhere with the
Taurus....

 

Well I have had American & Japanese cars. I have been studying consumer
reports reliability reports since the early 70's. Some European cars are
pretty good but when it comes to reliability the Japanese cars rule. I think
reliability has a lot to do with people liking the Japanese cars since the
70's I think that later on the Japanese cars surpassed the American cars in
such things as wind noise, ride,engine noise,handling etc. I think that the
American appearance is as good or better sometimes. The American car
companies could make better cars . I wish they would. I think many people
buy a car for the way it looks and that is why some people buy American
cars.There are many reasons I would guess that they buy American cars,
probably a lot buy American to buy American. So the American car companies
are only so worried about competition. The bottom line for them is all that
counts. Everybody has different standards of reliability, when you own a
couple of Japanese cars , unless you get a bad one and if your not bias I
think the standards go up.
Just my opinion.

Stephen

 

What about the Percentage? I mean there is a certain percentage of Japanese Cars . Did the Japanese cars need to be repaired as much American cars?